Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby stefano » Thu Jan 08, 2015 2:42 am

jingofever » Thu Jan 08, 2015 8:22 am wrote:What will this do for sales of Michel Houellebecq's new novel, which was published yesterday? Is the premise now more or less likely?

Less likely. More likely is what has been shaping since 2012: the FN keeps rising and the Gaullist right (absolutely sure to get in in 2017, whether Sarko comes back or not) adopts ever more extreme policies to stop the fascists stealing their votes. Sarko actually lost to Hollande because he was getting seriously distasteful and alienated a lot of support; I think the dynamic will be different next time.

Speaking of Houellebecq - the latest issue of Charlie Hebdo, sold out everywhere, takes the piss out of that sour little fucker in its leader:

Image

And this is the last cartoon by the late Cabu, who was killed yesterday. Eric Zemmour is another Muslim-hating propagandist who gets a lot of airtime these days.

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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby seemslikeadream » Thu Jan 08, 2015 2:57 am

A Hundred Years of Evil Folly: The Bloody Roots of the Paris Attack

WRITTEN BY CHRIS FLOYD
WEDNESDAY, 07 JANUARY 2015 23:45
As you might expect, the very secular "Angry Arab, As'ad AbuKhahlil, has some pertitent observations on the Charlie Hebdo attack. You should read the whole piece, but here are some excerpts from his "Notes on the shooting in Paris":

I feel strongly about the right to offend and to mock as an artist (and as a human being). That right should be absolute. .. Muslims do need to lighten up, and should feel secure enough to stomach mockery and satire against their religion. And they should not allow their enemies (even the bigots among them) to provoke them so easily....

... Yes, one should vehemently condemn the crimes against the cartoonist and writers and journalists but should in the same vein condemn the on-going French and US bombing raids that are taking place from Mali to Afghanistan, passing through Yemen and Syria. And those bombs are real and they are killing real people. Those are terrorist actions as much as the shooting in Paris was a terrorist action.

Western policies in Syria have produced, and will continue to produce, terrorist organizations the likes of which we have not seen since the creation of Al-Qa`idah. The enthusiastic policies of arming and sponsoring "rebel groups in Syria" are responsible for the proliferation of fanatical terrorist groups which will terrorize those countries that had sponsored them.

The source of all those terrorist groups is known: Gulf regimes and their Western sponsors. They have been indulging those regimes form the days of the Cold War. I was on the side of the left and progressive forces during the Cold War, while you--in the West--were on the side of those speaking the language of Jihad and...oil.

The direct roots -- and bitter fruits -- of actions like the attack in Paris and the depredations of ISIS in the ruins of American-raped Iraq go back 100 years, to the break-up of the Ottoman Empire, then forward through decades of fateful, and fatal, decisions by Western elites to support, advance -- and arm -- the most retrograde forms of Islam in order to prevent the rise of any alternatives to the authortiarian client states they favored in the region. At every turn, the West has exacerbated the century-long crisis within Islam, producing -- as AbuKhalil notes above -- a relentless series of extremist groups, each seemingly more virulent than the last, who, as he rightly says, "terrorize those countries that had sponsored them."

(For example, the latest news reports indicate that the Paris attackers probably had some kind of formal military training; they could well have fought in the Syrian "jihad" which the West and its extremist allies in the Middle East, like Saudi Arabia, have been fuelling for years with arms and aid. And who can forget -- except for 99 percent of the American political-media establishment, of course -- the original joint American-Saudi creation of the global jihadi movement in the late 70s and early 80s, designed as a "Great Game" ploy to goad the Soviets in Afghanistan?)

William Pfaff tells this long and sordid history in a powerful piece in The American Conservative, which appeared on line shortly before the Paris killings. It too is very much worth reading in full, but here is just one excerpt on the modern period of the tragic saga:

The “New Middle East,” officially proclaimed by NATO at the end of 2003, has conspicuously failed to appear, but it remains a goal of the expansionist neoconservative visionaries among the makers of American policy. In Bush’s government, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice wrote in Foreign Affairs in 2008, “Democratic state-building is now an urgent component in our national interest” reflecting a “uniquely American realism” teaching that it is America’s job “to change the world,” and in its own image. On September 11, 2014 the eminent dean of the School of Advanced International Studies of the Johns Hopkins University, Vali R. Nasr, wrote in the New York Times that America “must rally the whole region to support power-sharing—and nation building. This is a tall order. But the crises facing America demand a grand strategy…” A decade of failures has passed, but the grand design has not changed.

President Obama has declared that the jihadism of the new “Islamic State” is itself an incarnation of evil that must be deterred and destroyed. The two sides in this renewal of George W. Bush’s War Against Global Terror—Jews and Christians in the West and their Arab enemies—both consider themselves “people of the Book” and descendants of the Prophet Abraham. They have now become in their own minds actors in the apocalyptic destiny described in the Book of Revelation. Many American Evangelical Protestants have convinced themselves that contemporary American foreign policy can only be understood in such a context.

... Washington’s conduct since the 2001 attack by Islamic radicals on New York and the Pentagon has undermined or deliberately subverted institutions of international order to which, in the past, the United States was a leading contributor. The codes of international justice and morality, developed in the Western community of nations since the 17th century, have when expedient been disregarded or rejected, with demands that the United States be exempted from the jurisdiction of international law and even from what until recently were accepted norms of international morality concerning human rights and national sovereignty.

Thus the foreign policies of the United States have been stripped of a vital part of their assumed original moral content. An assimilation of modern totalitarian influences, values, and practices occurred in the United States after 2001, with state assassinations, selective drone killings, disregard of due process, torture, and permanent incarceration without trial justified by American leaders in their conduct of what has amounted to a war, not really of religions, as such, but between absolutisms, the one religious, and the other, ours, a political culture of extreme and solipsistic millenarian nationalism.

That is indeed an apt description of modern America. What we have seen played out in Paris is yet another manifestation of this insane and asymmetrical war between two absolutisms. The inevitable bellicose, repressive reaction to the crime of the individuals in Paris will be inflicted on the bodies of countless innocent people around the world -- and will, inevitably, blow back on the West itself. For a hundred years, at every turning we have taken the wrong road, leading us deeper and deeper into chaos and blood. No doubt we are about plung down yet another wrong turn.


Wednesday, January 07, 2015
Notes on the shooting in Paris
1) I used to be a cartoonist: as a child (I had my first school exhibit at age 10) and then as a boy but stopped once I discovered Marx and politics in my mid-teens. I even considered becoming a cartoonist but my talent was not great. So I feel strongly about the right to offend and to mock as an artist (and as a human being). That right should be absolute.
2) Muslims do need to lighten up, and should feel secure enough to stomach mockery and satire against their religion. And they should not allow their enemies (even the bigots among them) to provoke them so easily.
3) No, the magazine in question did not "equally" mock Muslims and Jews and others. This is like the way Islam is mocked by Bill Maher and others in the US: they don't hold the same standards. They reserve a special bitter and vicious streak against Islam and Muslims, and remember that France is not a country of absolute freedom of speech. You can go to jail in France and pay a fine if you offend Jewish people by mocking, say, the Holocaust. I believe that either there should be laws to protect the feelings of all religions, or--I prefer--there should not be protection whatsoever. IF there are idiots and bigots who want to offend Jews and Muslims they should be allowed to make fool of themselves.
4) It is idiotic for many reasons for Muslims to be easily provoked.
5) Excuse me: yes, one should vehemently condemn the crimes against the cartoonist and writers and journalists but should in the same vein condemn the on-going French and US bombing raids that are taking place from Mali to Afghanistan, passing through Yemen and Syria. And those bombs are real and they are killing real people. Those are terrorist actions as much as the shooting in Paris was a terrorist action.
6) Western policies in Syria have produced, and will continue to produce, terrorist organizations the likes of which we have not seen since the creation of Al-Qa`idah. The enthusiastic policies of arming and sponsoring "rebel groups in Syria" are responsible for the proliferation of fanatical terrorist groups which will terrorize those countries that had sponsored them.
7) the source of all those terrorist groups is known: Gulf regimes and their Western sponsors. They have been indulging those regimes form the days of the Cold War. I was on the side of the left and progressive forces during the Cold War, while you--in the West--were on the side of those speaking the language of Jihad and...oil.
Posted by As'ad AbuKhalil


Sharpening Contradictions: Why al-Qaeda attacked Satirists in Paris
By Juan Cole | Jan. 7, 2015 |

By Juan Cole | (Informed Comment)
The horrific murder of the editor, cartoonists and other staff of the irreverent satirical weekly Charlie Hebdo, along with two policemen, by terrorists in Paris was in my view a strategic strike, aiming at polarizing the French and European public.
The problem for a terrorist group like al-Qaeda is that its recruitment pool is Muslims, but most Muslims are not interested in terrorism. Most Muslims are not even interested in politics, much less political Islam. France is a country of 66 million, of which about 5 million is of Muslim heritage. But in polling, only a third, less than 2 million, say that they are interested in religion. French Muslims may be the most secular Muslim-heritage population in the world (ex-Soviet ethnic Muslims often also have low rates of belief and observance). Many Muslim immigrants in the post-war period to France came as laborers and were not literate people, and their grandchildren are rather distant from Middle Eastern fundamentalism, pursuing urban cosmopolitan culture such as rap and rai. In Paris, where Muslims tend to be better educated and more religious, the vast majority reject violence and say they are loyal to France.
Al-Qaeda wants to mentally colonize French Muslims, but faces a wall of disinterest. But if it can get non-Muslim French to be beastly to ethnic Muslims on the grounds that they are Muslims, it can start creating a common political identity around grievance against discrimination.
This tactic is similar to the one used by Stalinists in the early 20th century. Decades ago I read an account by the philosopher Karl Popper of how he flirted with Marxism for about 6 months in 1919 when he was auditing classes at the University of Vienna. He left the group in disgust when he discovered that they were attempting to use false flag operations to provoke militant confrontations. In one of them police killed 8 socialist youth at Hörlgasse on 15 June 1919. For the unscrupulous among Bolsheviks–who would later be Stalinists– the fact that most students and workers don’t want to overthrow the business class is inconvenient, and so it seemed desirable to some of them to “sharpen the contradictions” between labor and capital.
The operatives who carried out this attack exhibit signs of professional training. They spoke unaccented French, and so certainly know that they are playing into the hands of Marine LePen and the Islamophobic French Right wing. They may have been French, but they appear to have been battle hardened. This horrific murder was not a pious protest against the defamation of a religious icon. It was an attempt to provoke European society into pogroms against French Muslims, at which point al-Qaeda recruitment would suddenly exhibit some successes instead of faltering in the face of lively Beur youth culture (French Arabs playfully call themselves by this anagram). Ironically, there are reports that one of the two policemen they killed was a Muslim.
Al-Qaeda in Mesopotamia, then led by Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, deployed this sort of polarization strategy successfully in Iraq, constantly attacking Shiites and their holy symbols, and provoking the ethnic cleansing of a million Sunnis from Baghdad. The polarization proceeded, with the help of various incarnations of Daesh (Arabic for ISIL or ISIS, which descends from al-Qaeda in Mesopotamia). And in the end, the brutal and genocidal strategy worked, such that Daesh was able to encompass all of Sunni Arab Iraq, which had suffered so many Shiite reprisals that they sought the umbrella of the very group that had deliberately and systematically provoked the Shiites.
“Sharpening the contradictions” is the strategy of sociopaths and totalitarians, aimed at unmooring people from their ordinary insouciance and preying on them, mobilizing their energies and wealth for the perverted purposes of a self-styled great leader.
The only effective response to this manipulative strategy (as Grand Ayatollah Ali Sistani tried to tell the Iraqi Shiites a decade ago) is to resist the impulse to blame an entire group for the actions of a few and to refuse to carry out identity-politics reprisals.
For those who require unrelated people to take responsibility for those who claim to be their co-religionists (not a demand ever made of Christians), the al-Azhar Seminary, seat of Sunni Muslim learning and fatwas, condemned the attack, as did the Arab League that comprises 22 Muslim-majority states.
We have a model for response to terrorist provocation and attempts at sharpening the contradictions. It is Norway after Anders Behring Breivik committed mass murder of Norwegian leftists for being soft on Islam. The Norwegian government launched no war on terror. They tried Breivik in court as a common criminal. They remained committed to their admirable modern Norwegian values.
Most of France will also remain committed to French values of the Rights of Man, which they invented. But an insular and hateful minority will take advantage of this deliberately polarizing atrocity to push their own agenda. Europe’s future depends on whether the Marine LePens are allowed to become mainstream. Extremism thrives on other people’s extremism, and is inexorably defeated by tolerance.
Let me conclude by offering my profound condolences to the families, friends and fans of our murdered colleagues at Charlie Hebdo, including Stephane Charbonnier, Bernard Maris, and cartoonists Georges Wolinski Jean Cabut, aka Cabu, and Berbard Verlhac (Tignous)– and all the others. As Charbonnier, known as Charb, said, “I prefer to die standing than to live on my knees.”.
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby stefano » Thu Jan 08, 2015 3:21 am

Nordic » Thu Jan 08, 2015 2:05 am wrote:They've already named suspects. How? Reminds me of 9/11 when they named names a little too quickly.

They named the suspects after they'd tracked the shooters to a house in Reims. They know where everyone lives, and one of the dudes had been to jail for recruiting jihadists so could fairly be named as a suspect.
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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby justdrew » Thu Jan 08, 2015 3:24 am

well, one way nations subject to drone strikes could accelerate the end of those strike, would be to help identify, capture or kill terrorist organizations operating in those countries.
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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby Jerky » Thu Jan 08, 2015 4:17 am

Suggesting the attack on Charlie HEBDO might be a false-flag op perpetrated by the CIA, some shadow faction of the American ruling elite, or some even more shadowy European "strategy of tension(TM)" Euro-Gladio group?

(crickets)

Suggesting the attack on Charlie HEBDO might be a false-flag op perpetrated by the the MOSSAD (an organization with a pretty solid false flag track record on the books)?

"FUCKING ANTI-SEMITE!!!"

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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby semper occultus » Thu Jan 08, 2015 4:50 am

Nordic » 08 Jan 2015 00:05 wrote:Another thought: who are we to condemn this and resort to hatred when our own government drone-bombs wedding parties and slaughters innocent people on a far more regular and systematic basis. How is this any more horrifying than what the Zisraelis did to Gaza last year?

The hypocrisy I'm seeing today is, well, predictable and godawful. Embarrassing to the human race.



elfismiles » 07 Jan 2015 23:03 wrote:
kenoma » 07 Jan 2015 22:41 wrote:
It's been snowing tonight in Gaza. More will die there of hypothermia tonight than died in Paris today.


Yeah and I hear they wanna cut off power to the Pali-Gaza-Gulag.

More war crimes...



.....there might be some iota of justification if they actually drew attention to these issues , used this as justification for their atrocity & still more if they targeted the politicians & the financial & geopolitical puppetmasters responsible......

.......frankly it's quaint, nostalgic 70's retro-chic these days...the era of the RAF, Black September & Ilyich Ramirez Sanchez were a more innocent age ....we're dealing in the 21st Century with people who want to commit murder for drawing a cartoon of a magic sky pixie which they find offensive & presumably would still be entirely motivated to perpertrate their vengenace for God even if all the Afghans & Gazans were housed in luxury bomb-proof shelters with swimming pools.....
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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby smiths » Thu Jan 08, 2015 4:55 am

one things for sure, the bloke that shot the cop lying on the pavement had killed before

the nonchalance with which he finished the job demonstrated a professionalism and detachment that requires history

if i get told by the media in the next few days that the suspects were simply upset local Muslims who had no record of fighting somewhere before i will not believe it for a second
the question is why, who, why, what, why, when, why and why again?
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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby Nordic » Thu Jan 08, 2015 5:05 am

Well check this out. One of the shooters just happened to absent-mindedly drop his ID at the scene.

Remind anyone of some other attack?

Police found an ID document of Said Kouachi at the scene of the shooting, CNN affiliate BFMTV reported. "It was their only mistake," said Dominique Rizet, BFMTV's police and justice consultant, reporting that the discovery helped the investigation.



9/11 was 14 years ago this year. Ancient history. It can be assumed people are forgetful.

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/07/europ ... e-gunfire/


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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby smiths » Thu Jan 08, 2015 5:06 am

i have to agree Nordic, that little detail stinks
the question is why, who, why, what, why, when, why and why again?
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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby Nordic » Thu Jan 08, 2015 5:07 am

Those guys were so casual yet "professional" in that tape, we're supposed to believe one of them dropped an ID card???
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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby stefano » Thu Jan 08, 2015 5:08 am

semper occultus » Thu Jan 08, 2015 10:50 am wrote:people who want to commit murder for drawing a cartoon of a magic sky pixie which they find offensive & presumably would still be entirely motivated to perpertrate their vengenace for God even if all the Afghans & Gazans were housed in luxury bomb-proof shelters with swimming pools.....
I don't think so, hey. Everything I've read about people who join a jihad underlines the way in which rage about injustices against Muslims - usually in Palestine or Chechnya - is the first motivator. Things change afterwards, once these guys start undergoing the very well planned and written indoctrination lessons and get coaching from cell leaders, but Palestine is a major thing.

I get pretty irritated at that kind of reflexive whataboutery too, though - as though nothing is news except the worst thing that is happening anywhere. Or the worst thing that ever happened?

Very fishy bit about the ID!
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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby stefano » Thu Jan 08, 2015 5:21 am

Liberation says the card was dropped in the black Citroen they hijacked. That's ridiculous.

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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby semper occultus » Thu Jan 08, 2015 5:22 am

.....mmmm a nasty whiff of manure detectable here aswell........and so it begins......the lady in the red dress just walked past......eating my words already.....back into the fucking Matrix everyone.....
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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby Grizzly » Thu Jan 08, 2015 5:23 am

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026055424
Banksy weighs in Charles Hebdo.

To tired to post, the work, would someone here do the honors?
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Re: Gun attack on French magazine Charlie Hebdo kills 11

Postby stefano » Thu Jan 08, 2015 5:49 am

Just a thought - if tension is what you want, then a little something like that, making manipulation visible to those who are willing to see it, can only help. Lots of message boards have started going on about the ID, that it proves a false flag. Comments on other sites are either accepting of the story. This will further divide opinion.

A kebab shop next to a mosque was bombed in Villefranche-sur-Saône (centre-east) this morning. No injuries.
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