The build-up to war on Russia

Moderators: Elvis, DrVolin, Jeff

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby Searcher08 » Sun Aug 07, 2016 9:20 am

Nordic » Sun Aug 07, 2016 4:36 am wrote:My god what a crock of fucking shit about Russia there. ^^^^

Infuriating. Total 180-degree divergence from the truth.

Whoever writes this propaganda is every bit the war criminal as the neonazis who are slaughtering civilians in the Donbas. They should be dealt with like any other war criminal.

My god look at the shit this monster gets paid to write. All of it is in this vein. Leni Reifenstahl couldn't have done it better.

http://www.newsweek.com/user/17415


He is not a war criminal, he is a hero, who has flown and fought for America, for YOUR freedoms etc etc
http://www.nolanwpeterson.com/about-me/
User avatar
Searcher08
 
Posts: 5887
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:21 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby seemslikeadream » Sun Aug 07, 2016 3:20 pm

gotta love Americans....we can have a war with about Russia....without Putin even getting involved ...we just take sides and fight each other

who would trump bomb?
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
User avatar
seemslikeadream
 
Posts: 32090
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:28 pm
Location: into the black
Blog: View Blog (83)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby DrEvil » Sun Aug 07, 2016 3:33 pm

Gaah! Now I'm picturing Trump shouting "You're fired!" just before hitting the big red button.
"I only read American. I want my fantasy pure." - Dave
User avatar
DrEvil
 
Posts: 4144
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2010 1:37 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby seemslikeadream » Sun Aug 07, 2016 3:38 pm

DrEvil » Sun Aug 07, 2016 2:33 pm wrote:Gaah! Now I'm picturing Trump shouting "You're fired!" just before hitting the big red button.



his long pause before hitting the button

"Do I have any properties in San Franciso?"
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
User avatar
seemslikeadream
 
Posts: 32090
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:28 pm
Location: into the black
Blog: View Blog (83)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby seemslikeadream » Thu Aug 11, 2016 10:43 am

Ukraine, Russia Trade Angry Accusations as War Fever Mounts

Jamie Dettmer
August 11, 2016 9:52 AM

KYIV, UKRAINE—
Ukraine and Russia were locked in a war of words Thursday over the Kremlin’s claim that Kyiv infiltrated trained saboteurs into Crimea tasked with targeting “critical infrastructure” — an alleged mission Russian President Vladimir Putin is now citing as the reason for his decision to pull out of scheduled peace talks in Normandy.

Ukrainian officials say the sabotage mission is pure “fantasy,” arguing the Kremlin is likely to use it as a pretext for a major escalation of the two-year-long conflict in east Ukraine, where Moscow-backed forces are occupying a large chunk of the Donbas region, including the cities of Donetsk and Luhansk.

Moscow has so far failed to present the group of saboteurs it says were detained at the weekend near the city of Armyansk after the sabotage mission was thwarted.

http://www.voanews.com/content/ukraine- ... 60130.html
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
User avatar
seemslikeadream
 
Posts: 32090
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:28 pm
Location: into the black
Blog: View Blog (83)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby Nordic » Thu Aug 11, 2016 1:17 pm

And you know the Uke saboteurs would never have done that without our permission and promises of backing them up.

October Surprise could easily be war with Russia over Ukraine. Because Halliburton HAS to frack it, and Monsanto HAS to take over the massive agriculture there and John Deere HAS to supply all the farm machinery and they all HAVE to control the gas pipelines through there.

It's our patriotic duty to support the great loss of human life on behalf of Team America Corporation Nation.
"He who wounds the ecosphere literally wounds God" -- Philip K. Dick
Nordic
 
Posts: 14230
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 3:36 am
Location: California USA
Blog: View Blog (6)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby Nordic » Mon Aug 15, 2016 3:14 pm

This is awesome.

http://www.unz.com/freed/hillary-trump- ... th-russia/

Hillary, Trump, and War with Russia
The Goddamdest Stupid Idea I Have Ever Heard, and I Have Lived in Washington
Fred Reed • August 11, 2016
• 1,200 Words • 188 Comments • Reply
T14
Don’t look for a walk-over. The T14 Armata, Russia’s latest tank. You don’t want to fight this monster if you can think of a better idea, such as not fighting it. Russia once made large numbers of second-rate tanks. That worm has turned. This thing is way advanced and outguns the American M1A2, having a 125mm smoothbore firing APFSDS long-rods to the Abrams 120mm. (As Hillary would know, that’s Armor-piercing, fin-stabilized, discarding-sabot. You did know, didn’t you, Hill?) This isn’t the place for a disquisition on armor, but the above beast is a very advanced design with unmanned turret and, well, a T34 it isn’t. (I was once an aficionado of tanks. If interested, here and here.)

A good reason to vote for Trump, a very good reason whatever his other intentions, is that he does not want a war with Russia. Hillary and her elite ventriloquists threaten just that. Note the anti-Russian hysteria coming from her and her remoras.

Such a war would be yet another example of the utter control of America by rich insiders. No normal American has anything at all to gain by such a war. And no normal American has the slightest influence over whether such a war takes place, except by voting for Trump. The military has become entirely the plaything of unaccountable elites.

A martial principle of great wisdom says that military stupidity comes in three grades: Ordinarily stupid; really, really, really stupid; and fighting Russia. Think Charles XII at Poltava, Napoleon after Borodino, Adolf and Kursk.

Letting dilettantes, grifters, con men, pasty Neocons, bottle-blonde ruins, and corporations decide on war is insane. We have pseudo-masculine dwarves playing with things they do not understand. So far as I am aware, none of these fern-bar Clausewitzes has worn boots, been in a war, seen a war, or faces any chance of being in a war started by themselves. They brought us Iraq, Afghanistan, and Isis, and can’t win wars against goatherds with AKs. They are going to fight…Russia?

A point that the tofu ferocities of New York might bear in mind is that wars seldom turn out as expected, usually with godawful results. We do not know what would happen in a war with Russia. Permit me a tedious catalog to make this point. It is very worth making.

When Washington pushed the South into the Civil War, it expected a conflict that might be over in twenty-four hours, not four years with as least 650,000 dead. When Germany began WWI, it expected a swift lunge into Paris, not four years of hideously bloody static war followed by unconditional surrender. When the Japanese Army pushed for attacking Pearl, it did not foresee GIs marching in Tokyo and a couple of cities glowing at night. When Hitler invaded Poland, utter defeat and occupation of Germany was not among his war aims. When the US invaded Vietnam, it did not expect to be outfought and outsmarted by a bush-world country. When Russia invaded Afghanistan it did not expect…nor when America invaded Afghanistan, nor when it attacked Iraq, nor….

Is there a pattern here?

The standard American approach to war is to underestimate the enemy, overestimate American capacities, and misunderstand the kind of war it enters. This is particularly true when the war is a manhood ritual for masculine inadequates–think Kristol, Podhoretz, Sanders, the whole Neocon milk bar, and that mendacious wreck, Hillary, who has the military grasp of a Shetland pony. If you don’t think weak egos and perpetual adolescence have a part in deciding policy, read up on Kaiser Wilhelm.

Now, if Washington accidentally or otherwise provoked a war with Russia in, say, the Baltics or the Ukraine, and actually used its own forces, where might this lead, given the Pentagon’s customary delusional optimism? A very serious possibility is a humiliating American defeat. The US has not faced a real enemy in a long time. In that time the armed forces have been feminized and social-justice warriorified, with countless officials having been appointed by Obama for reasons of race and sex. Training has been watered down to benefit girl soldiers, physical standards lowered, and the ranks of general officers filled with perfumed political princes. Russia is right there at the Baltic borders: location, location, location. Somebody said, “Amateurs think strategy, professionals think logistics.” Uh-huh. The Russians are not pansies and they are not primitive.

What would Washington do, what would New York make Washington do, having been handed its ass in a very public defeat? Huge egos would be in play, the credibility of the whole American empire. Could little Hillary Dillary Pumpkin Pie force NATO into a general war with Russia, or would the Neocons try to go it alone–with other people’s lives? (Russia also has borders with Eastern Europe, which connects to Western Europe. Do you suppose the Europeans would think of this?) Would Washington undertake, or try to undertake, the national mobilization that would be necessary to fight Russia in its backyard? Naval war? Nukes in desperation?

And, since Russia is not going to invade anybody unprovoked, Washington would have to attack. See above, the three forms of military stupidity.

The same danger exists incidentally with regard to a war with China in the South China Sea. The American Navy hasn’t fought a war in seventy years. It doesn’t know how well its armament works. The Chinese, who are not fools, have invested in weaponry specifically designed to defeat carrier battle groups. A carrier in smoking ruins would force Washington to start a wider war to save face, with unpredictable results. Can you name one American, other than the elites, who has anything to gain from war with China?

What has any normal American, as distinct from the elites and various lobbies, gained from any of our wars post Nine-Eleven? Hillary and her Neocon pack have backed all of them.

It is easy to regard countries as suprahuman beings that think and take decisions and do things. Practically speaking, countries consist of a small number of people, usually men, who make decisions for reasons often selfish, pathologically aggressive, pecuniary, delusional, misinformed, or actually psychopathic in the psychiatric sense. For example, the invasion of Iraq, a disaster, was pushed by the petroleum lobbies to get the oil, the arms lobbies to get contracts, the Jewish lobbies to get bombs dropped on Israel’s enemies, the imperialists for empire, and the congenitally combative because that is how they think. Do you see anything in the foregoing that would matter to a normal American? These do not add up to a well-conceived policy. Considerations no better drive the desire to fight Russia or to force it to back down.

I note, pointlessly, that probably none of America’s recent martial catastrophes would have occurred if we still had constitutional government. How many congressmen do you think would vote for a declaration of war if they had to tell their voters that they had just launched, for no reason of importance to Americans, an attack on the homeland of a nuclear power?

There are lots of reasons not to vote for Clinton and the suppurating corruption she represents. Not letting her owners play with matches rates high among them.
"He who wounds the ecosphere literally wounds God" -- Philip K. Dick
Nordic
 
Posts: 14230
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 3:36 am
Location: California USA
Blog: View Blog (6)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby stefano » Mon Aug 15, 2016 3:49 pm

Yeah, that is awesome. I have a quibble, though:

Fred Reed wrote:What has any normal American, as distinct from the elites and various lobbies, gained from any of our wars post Nine-Eleven?

Lots, actually. For starters, a military that is recruiting all the time, paying $18,802.80 a year as absolute base pay. That's more than I was making five years ago, as a 32-year-old with two degrees. That that kind of opportunity buys a measure of political quiescence at home. And those elites' companies pay well, too. How many ordinary Americans have done work for Halliburton, or KBR, or ExxonMobil, that was made possible by an war? Lots, and they were paid a lot better than people with similar qualifications from other countries (and, needless to say, the Iraqis who could easily have done the job). The same dynamic operates in a more indirect way. The fact of US military superiority, and Washington's evident willingness to use it (we don't even need to get into the blackmail and bribery angles here), means that other governments are forced to give business to US companies, and that business pays the salaries of Americans.

Americans' extraordinary material prosperity, generally speaking, does come to them thanks to the war machine.

This also means that Cheney and Clinton and so on do, in some real sense, work on behalf of the American people.
User avatar
stefano
 
Posts: 2672
Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:50 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby American Dream » Mon Aug 15, 2016 4:58 pm

Nordic » Mon Aug 15, 2016 2:14 pm wrote:
This is awesome.

http://www.unz.com/freed/hillary-trump- ... th-russia/

A good reason to vote for Trump, a very good reason whatever his other intentions, is that he does not want a war with Russia.


I can't really consider that awesome at all, even if though I am against War and against Imperialism...
American Dream
 
Posts: 19946
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2007 4:56 pm
Location: Planet Earth
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby Sounder » Mon Aug 15, 2016 5:39 pm

stefano wrote...
This also means that Cheney and Clinton and so on do, in some real sense, work on behalf of the American people.

It's good to be reminded of this, thanks.
All these things will continue as long as coercion remains a central element of our mentality.
Sounder
 
Posts: 4054
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 8:49 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Aug 15, 2016 5:51 pm

A good reason to vote for Trump, a very good reason whatever his other intentions, is that he does not want a war with Russia.


oh fricking jumping jesus on a pogo stick.....what part of Trump is a fucking liar isn't clear to everyone
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
User avatar
seemslikeadream
 
Posts: 32090
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:28 pm
Location: into the black
Blog: View Blog (83)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby Nordic » Mon Aug 15, 2016 6:16 pm

Well we know Hillary wants war with Russia.

And according to you, even though Trump has said over and over he doesn't want war with Russia, and Putin does in fact seem to rather have Trump instead of Hillary so they won't end up at war, we're still not quite sure if he's lying or not ...

Between a sure thing and a "somewhat possible" thing I would prefer the one that wasn't the sure thing.

Should be a priority. All the indignation about his racism won't count for shit if we're all killed in a nuclear war. I dont see why that's so hard to understand.
Last edited by Nordic on Tue Aug 16, 2016 2:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
"He who wounds the ecosphere literally wounds God" -- Philip K. Dick
Nordic
 
Posts: 14230
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 3:36 am
Location: California USA
Blog: View Blog (6)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby stillrobertpaulsen » Mon Aug 15, 2016 6:17 pm

seemslikeadream » Mon Aug 15, 2016 4:51 pm wrote:
A good reason to vote for Trump, a very good reason whatever his other intentions, is that he does not want a war with Russia.


oh fricking jumping jesus on a pogo stick.....what part of Trump is a fucking liar isn't clear to everyone


To paraphrase Bill Hicks, what part of the most important part of a President's job is to ask the Elite, "What's my agenda?" isn't clear to everyone?

Trump reverses NATO stance, vows to work closely with alliance to beat Islamic State

If his stance on NATO being "obsolete" isn't sacrosanct, does anyone here really think President Trump wouldn't receive the motivation to divest in his Russian holdings?
User avatar
stillrobertpaulsen
 
Posts: 2414
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:43 pm
Location: Gone baby gone
Blog: View Blog (37)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby Agent Orange Cooper » Mon Aug 15, 2016 8:55 pm

If Trump is just waiting to be given his orders then why is every major figure in the policy-making wing of the MIC and the media at large in vociferous opposition to him? Wouldn't he be their dream candidate since Hillary and the rest of the GOP slate are so pathetically unelectable? Or is it all just a big reverse psychology ploy?
User avatar
Agent Orange Cooper
 
Posts: 616
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 2:44 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: The build-up to war on Russia

Postby SonicG » Mon Aug 15, 2016 9:19 pm

Agent Orange Cooper » Tue Aug 16, 2016 7:55 am wrote:If Trump is just waiting to be given his orders then why is every major figure in the policy-making wing of the MIC and the media at large in vociferous opposition to him? Wouldn't he be their dream candidate since Hillary and the rest of the GOP slate are so pathetically unelectable? Or is it all just a big reverse psychology ploy?


Who knows how the dynamic works but on the surface, it seems that he is finally being convinced that he has to be more "sane" about the current global geo-political structure...Trump is realizing, way too late, that his insane promises will only get him so far, although his latest immigrant admittance test will only work against him...The "No war with Russia" claim is fine but I never really see it mentioned, and I really wonder how much of his hardcore base is behind that. Putin is nothing but evil in the USA media, or am I wrong?
Trump is sinking fast, momentum is everything in US elections and he has no time to reverse it...
"a poiminint tidal wave in a notion of dynamite"
User avatar
SonicG
 
Posts: 1512
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2009 7:29 pm
Blog: View Blog (0)

PreviousNext

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 165 guests