American music ?

by **km artlu** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 4:48 pm

"Is rap/hip-hop a product of cointelpro?" In the film "Crash" there's a brilliant and funny rant about that by one of the ensemble characters (played by Ludicris, an American rapper). It was a kick for me to find that in the film, as it paraphrased a few rants of my own.

by **scollon** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 5:16 pm

My though (unstated) is that my music collection after the '60s (excluding NY Punk) is almost exclusively British. This is remarkable considering the relative size of the two countries. I am very open to American music and like some new bands . All the major original bands worldwide in the seventies were British, fom Zeppelin to Quo to Queen, Yes, Bowie, Genesis, Roxy, Bowie, Jethro Tull, Floyd, King Crimson and so on. Am I just ignorant ? Please tell me.

by **HMKGrey** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 5:49 pm

Readers of this board and Jeff's blog really owe it to themselves to track down some of the early to mid-eighties British anarcho-punk that was produced by bands like CRASS, Conflict, FLUX of PINK INDIANS and The Mob. It's raw, incredibly fast and noisy but the lyrics (always handily supplied)_ are incredibly prescient of our current times. Conflict were always my personal favorite. They had amazing lyrics and you always knew that they were capable of reaching a much wider audience if they gave up the noise and tried to but then as you got to know them you started to understand too that the noise was all part of the art... they couldn't be less noisy because they were so damn, genuinely angry. These days, as a father and loyal worker etc I still pull them out for a quick listen every once in a while but for the most part I'm listening to hip hop on the Anticon label (righteous dudes from Oakland) and much of the Brit stuff sicussed elsewhere. BTW, the new Cat Power album is a winner.

by **boundary tech** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 6:00 pm

The Wire magazine is a good resource for modern music. Focus is mainly on electronica, but they also cover "avant" rock, dub, jazz, hiphop, "outer limits" stuff, etc. A lot of good stuff out there, American or otherwise. <a href="http://www.thewire.co.uk/index.html">www.thewire.co.uk/index.html</a>

by **Bilbo Hicks** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 7:34 pm

"Is rap / hip hop a product of cointelpro ?" Not to flame, but I think that's your bias coming into it a little bit. Public Enemy is some of the most powerful music I've heard, up there with The Clash for me. A lot of great rap/hip-hop never makes it to the mainstream. But yeah in terms of mainstream (gangsta etc..) rap and the stereotypical stuff, I sometimes wonder if it is encouraged more than just having a well defined market product to sell.

by **scollon** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 7:48 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>"Is rap / hip hop a product of cointelpro ?"<hr></blockquote> What I meant was that it might be a product of cointelpro operations to flood black areas with drugs and encourage a non political materialistic culture in which people fight each other for money / drugs rather than their oppressors as happened in the sixties. It's the perfect capitalist music. I heard some awesome hip hop beats recently but the culture is totally foreign to me, I seriously don't like it and wouldn't mind if it disappeared completely and quickly from these shores, yes. I blame MTV and if they are promoting black culture, I'm a Martian.

by **prunesquallori** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 8:06 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>What I meant was that it might be a product of cointelpro operations to flood black areas with drugs and encourage a non political materialistic culture in which people fight each other for money / drugs rather than their oppressors as happened in the sixties.<hr></blockquote> Nahhh. Maybe some particular corporate rapper. Rap and hiphop have deep roots in reggae and 5-Percenter culture, which are greatly opposed to the Beast. Certainly feds and cointelpro get involved, but hiphop is a legitimate "counter culture." Check out the lyrcs to Immortal Technique/Mos Def's track "bin Laden": <blockquote>Quote:<hr> Artist: Immortal Technique f/ Mos Def Album: Bin Laden 12" Song: Bin Laden Typed by: em_amaru@yahoo.com * * send corrections to the typist [Mos Def - talking] Man, you hear this bullshit they be talkin' Every day, man It's like these motherfuckers is just like professional liars YouknowwhatI'msayin? It's wild Listen [Hook - Mos Def] Bin Laden didn't blow up the projects It was you, nigga Tell the truth, nigga (Bush knocked down the towers)--[Jadakiss] Tell the truth, nigga (Bush knocked down the towers)--[Jadakiss] Tell the truth, nigga Bin Laden didn't blow up the projects It was you, nigga Tell the truth, nigga (Bush knocked down the towers)--[Jadakiss] Tell the truth, nigga (Bush knocked down the towers)--[Jadakiss] [Verse 1 - Immortal Technique] I pledge no allegiance, nigga fuck the president's speeches I'm baptized by America and covered in leeches The dirty water that bleaches your soul and your facial features Drownin' you in propaganda that they spit through the speakers And if you speak about the evil that the government does The Patriot Act'll track you to the type of your blood They try to frame you, and say you was tryna sell drugs And throw a federal indictment on niggaz to show you love This shit is run by fake Christians, fake politicians Look at they mansions, then look at the conditions you live in All they talk about is terrorism on television They tell you to listen, but they don't really tell you they mission They funded Al-Qaeda, and now they blame the Muslim religion Even though Bin Laden, was a CIA tactician They gave him billions of dollars, and they funded his purpose Fahrenheit 9/11, that's just scratchin' the surface [Hook] [Verse 2 - Immortal Technique] They say the rebels in Iraq still fight for Saddam But that's bullshit, I'll show you why it's totally wrong Cuz if another country invaded the hood tonight It'd be warfare through Harlem, and Washington Heights I wouldn't be fightin' for Bush or White America's dream I'd be fightin' for my people's survival and self-esteem I wouldn't fight for racist churches from the south, my nigga I'd be fightin' to keep the occupation out, my nigga You ever clock someone who talk shit, or look at you wrong? Imagine if they shot at you, and was rapin' your moms And of course Saddam Hussein had chemical weapons We sold him that shit, after Ronald Reagan's election Mercenary contractors fightin' a new era Corporate military bankin' off the war on terror They controllin' the ghetto, with the failed attack Tryna distract the fact that they engineerin' the crack So I'm strapped like Lee Malvo holdin' a sniper rifle These bullets'll touch your kids, and I don't mean like Michael Your body be sent to the morgue, stripped down and recycled I fire on house niggaz that support you and like you Cuz innocent people get murdered in the struggle daily And poor people never get shit and struggle daily This ain't no alien conspiracy theory, this shit is real Written on the dollar underneath the Masonic seal (I don't rap for dead presidents I'd rather see the president dead It's never been said but I set precedents)--[Eminem] [Hook] (Shady Records was 80 seconds away from the towers Some cowards fucked with the wrong building, they meant to hit ours)-- [Eminem]<hr></blockquote>

by **scollon** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 8:16 pm

Interesting, they don't play that on MTV and it's MTV stuff I'm talking about. It's big business. As I said the culture is totally alien to me in a way that other black music wasn't in the past. There seems to be an air of violence in it.

by **prunesquallori** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 8:36 pm

There is plenty of substance abuse, murder, and crime in general in old American folk and blues, from both blacks and whites. It seems to me like MTV stuff is largely sold to white kids. Most black folks I know don't listen to that stuff too much. The popular rap in my area is sometimes made by REAL local gangsters, or underground favs like Mac Dre.

by **Bilbo Hicks** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 8:40 pm

"What I meant was that it might be a product of cointelpro operations to flood black areas with drugs and encourage a non political materialistic culture in which people fight each other for money / drugs rather than their oppressors as happened in the sixties." Yep, Im sure there must be an element of cointelpro involved at some level, though it would only be exacerbating something which is already there due to other social reasons. A lot of african americans simply dont feel like the system can change, so they become apathetic to it. This gaudy materialism IMO is another part of the US culture of consumerism, mixed in with certain aspects of poor black street culture. The 'thug' culture is there because people turn to drugs to make a living, its real. The celebration of it in the mainstream I think reflects a lot about the culture we have in the US, so I wonder if cointelpro would need to work that hard at it. The situation reminds me somewhat of the drinking/party/hooligan culture you see predominately in the working classes in the UK. People simply have apathy to the fact that things wont change, so they escape, which is what most gangsta rap is..escapism. EDIT: Yep I love Mos Def too. I think he wrote that after he moved to Canada :-) Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=bilbohicks@rigorousintuition>Bilbo Hicks</A> at: 1/13/06 5:43 pm

by **prunesquallori** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 8:44 pm

<a href="http://www.boingboing.net/2005/09/08/katrina_kanye_remixe.html">www.boingboing.net/2005/0...emixe.html</a>

by **yablonsky** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 8:47 pm

Escapism [redman] Hooo-ahhh! High as a motherfucker Zonin on cloud nineteen as the def squad takes you On another eerie place... of a dark side Yesssss!!! [keith murray] I escape from the world To show niggaz that my style is superb For what it’s worth I’m gettin off planet earth But I gotta redefine gravity first So I figure, I get my guns and I bust the biggest cap From the demand of the trigger I’m equipped to dip with a knapsack And a survival kit, with blunts n shit (word!) I’m in all black, ? with a face? money Wanna double to nasa, to hijack a space shuttle More ages than curiosity I enter the backdoor with animosity (yeah, here’s murray!) Searchin for the astronauts, checkin my watch Determined the time I had to be out I saw my prey without a second delay Suited up, strapped down, straight and on my way For five seconds to liftoff I was in the hell When I escaped from the world I escaped from the world (4x) So far... I went through a milky way of stars And landed on my destination, which was mars (whoa, shit!) This planet was foreign and new As I’m puffin on a blunt, observin the view To my surprise, a spaceship arrived Out came a martian, with six fingers and three eyes He spoke a bleeky type of dialect (bleek, bleek bleek bleek bleek bleek) But understood my form of intellect I said, I’m keith murray from the planet earth Boy I’m psychosomatic and homicidal with a verse My hypercritical form of words busts his brains And then the whole atmosphere changed (what the fuck? ) Rrarahrhagharhar rharhagahgahrahgh I was surrounded by some martians in the hut about to front I used my last resort, and pulled out the blunts Lit it, got the whole martian crew blitted So now’s my chance to try to get acquitted I said, I escaped from the planet earth To let my mind untwirl because I’m mad at the world And the murder wasn’t premeditated My language was just mis-interpretated One acknowledge I’m right and pulled out the peace pipe Aight? about to set the vibes right He lit it with his finger, I smelled the martian buddha linger I felt good cause I released some anger No sooner than the cease of the herb ignite I was headed back to earth at the speed of light Upon my return niggaz thought I was in jail Nah kids... I escaped from the world [redman] As we zone, on the cosmic type of funk (escapism y’all) We drop mad flows, for the 1990’s (escapism y’all, escapism y’all) The funk doctor spock signin off live (escapism y’all, escapism y’all, escapism y’all) This is how we do (escapism y’all, escapism -- escape from the world) Flows enough for the nineteen ninties and we out! (escapism y’all)

by **scollon** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 8:50 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>The situation reminds me somewhat of the drinking/party/hooligan culture you see predominately in the working classes in the UK. <hr></blockquote> No doubt that's where the resonance is here. My situation is that I used to live in a very sheltered world with a car etc., now I walk and see / hear things I had forgotten about. Just exactly what you're referring to in fact. It isn't just poverty it's a sense of defeat as you say and the effects of alcohol can be seen in most of the faces. I stopped drinking a very long time ago. and in a typical reformed way, I hate it and the accompanying violence !! I absolutely loved the dance / trance / rave culture, hip hop just sems so dirty, nasty and violent in comparison. Different drugs of course.

by **nashvillebrook** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 8:58 pm

if yer online, you have access to everything streaming. if you're on a mac, just open iTunes and explore the radio dial. we have Sirius satellite and i love it! you have to be an informed consumer to enjoy music, now it seems. i grew up with AOR radio and still love 60s and 70s deep cuts, but garage is the genre closest to my heart. having said that, who would imagine i could fall in love with the new Fiona Apple. wow. what an amazing recording. i would have never picked it up if i had not heard it on Fresh Air. now it's one of my all time faves. can't put it down.

by **prunesquallori** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 8:59 pm

The new Fiona Apple IS great, isn't it! I never liked her at all before.

American music ?

Bad Music

British

Great Music

The Wire

Re: American music ?

Re: American music ?

Rap

Re: Rap

black music from the past

Re: American music ?

Why not another one

most gangsta rap is..escapism.

Re: American music ?

radio killed itself

Haha!

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