Thread for Elvis

Moderators: Elvis, DrVolin, Jeff

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby Belligerent Savant » Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:10 pm

RocketMan » Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:55 pm wrote:
seemslikeadream » Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:48 pm wrote:Both mods were here on the 2 of October correct

And why does Jack and Mac think you are their mod, that you were cleaning the place up for them at least that is what they are saying publicly


Casting aspersions on mods now? Just recently you were on your high horse about how low exactly that is. This is ridiculous conduct and you know it.

This whole situation is weird, some old faces have suddenly popped up to crow, in a seemingly coordinated manner etc. Seems to me there's some bad faith actions taken here.


^^^^^^^^

Indeed.

This portion from Elvis' response is particularly noteworthy:

I always said what I was doing and why I was doing it, and sometimes public discussion preceded any action taken. The recent actions of my fellow moderator, in concert with a small but vocal group, were all done in secret.


Elvis has been transparent in his actions. AD's recent premature lifting of his suspension was done fully in secret, with no notification either before or after it occurred.

Why?
Last edited by Belligerent Savant on Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Belligerent Savant
 
Posts: 5587
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:58 pm
Location: North Atlantic.
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:11 pm

He was not transparent on Oct 2. 82 was here on Oct 2


Jeff has stated he wants no one banned
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
User avatar
seemslikeadream
 
Posts: 32090
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:28 pm
Location: into the black
Blog: View Blog (83)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby Belligerent Savant » Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:13 pm

.
What happened on Oct 2?

And you're misrepresenting - again. Jack and Mac are not claiming Elvis is "their" mod.
User avatar
Belligerent Savant
 
Posts: 5587
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:58 pm
Location: North Atlantic.
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:06 pm

Jeff says

I don’t want anybody banned


seemslikeadream » Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:49 pm wrote:cross posting so Jeff's post does not get missed

Jeff » Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:18 pm wrote:There's no way this won't sound anodyne, but isn't the board big enough for everyone?

I won't pretend to be up to speed on all of the disagreements here, but maybe that's good. The issues are maybe irrelevant to my point, which is that you don't all need to be pals, but maybe you do need to give each other some space.

I don't want anybody banned or the board to be heavily moderated. In return, all I'd like is some basic, online courtesy. Like not flooding someone's thread, or driving discussion off topic, or making vicious personal attacks. That kind of stuff.

Jeff out
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
User avatar
seemslikeadream
 
Posts: 32090
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:28 pm
Location: into the black
Blog: View Blog (83)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby Iamwhomiam » Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:53 pm

Elvis, I like you, I think you know that. But I have a problem with this bit you've shared:
I always said what I was doing and why I was doing it, and sometimes public discussion preceded any action taken. The recent actions of my fellow moderator, in concert with a small but vocal group, were all done in secret.


Your claim as expressed in your first sentence is easily proved wrong. I distinctly remember the hassle I got from more than one member, though BS was most extreme, for asking our moderators why AD had been banned, what rule had he broken, as Jeff would always do before suspending or banning any individual.

To date, neither moderator has responded with an explanation, and never reported what particular rule AD had broken.

That action was orchestrated by a small but vocal group, in secret, without informing the board beforehand. PMs are always supposed to be secret, but there is a great difference in an organized cabal communicating via PM with a moderator with a focus to remove another RI member and a complaint of rule breaking performed by any member.

What makes your position of being fair to all seem a bit off-balance, is that you are playing a dual role as posting member and as a moderator, and have personally engaged in strong argument with AD, and that seems to me to have prejudiced your judgment. At least it appears that way to me. I'm sorry about that, but it is my honest opinion, based upon my observations.

Some have shared their disappointment with past moderators, faulting them for not being more readily responsive, or for their alleged poor ability in moderating, for not agreeing with the complainant's demand, or some other unmet expectation, but never have any been so insulted as we've recently seen.

So let's be honest, who's been disruptive? AD? Or others?

Either moderator should be equally empowered to act independently, and should support each other, and never publicly criticize or question another moderator's actions.

So who remembers Jack's previously held position as our moderator? Remember how long that lasted, or why he is no longer one of our moderators? At the time, I felt Jack would make a great moderator, but I no longer due, and that's only because of his behavior towards others here he disagrees with, no matter how sound his reason for disagreement.

I hope you're not too offended, Jack, but it's truly how I feel. You too, Elvis, I hope you do not take offense to my criticism either, I understand you're in the middle of an ugly fight, and have been placed in a damned if you do or damned if you don't situation.

What is rather surprising is the complaints keep coming, after Jeff has requested our poorly behaving adults to behave better. And they've now spread across several threads. AD is not who is the disruptive one posting here, as should be obvious to anyone with eyesight reading these pages.
User avatar
Iamwhomiam
 
Posts: 6572
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2007 2:47 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby Iamwhomiam » Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:02 pm

Belligerent savant wrote:
Elvis has been transparent in his actions. AD's recent premature lifting of his suspension was done fully in secret, with no notification either before or after it occurred.

Why?


Holy shit! After pages and pages from you condemning me asking for a reason for AD's banning, now you feel you deserve an explanation from our mods for his return? truly fucked up. Be glad I don't go back and shove your response to me right back down your throat.

Can you tell who I really do not like here? You, dude, it's only you.
User avatar
Iamwhomiam
 
Posts: 6572
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2007 2:47 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:06 pm

Jeff wants no one banned

Why is that so hard to understand

He came here to state that just a couple of days ago

No other explanation is needed

Some people have no respect for the owner of this place, it’s his place what is the difficulty in the comprehension of that simple fact
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
User avatar
seemslikeadream
 
Posts: 32090
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:28 pm
Location: into the black
Blog: View Blog (83)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby Belligerent Savant » Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:14 pm

Iamwhomiam » Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:02 pm wrote:
Belligerent savant wrote:
Elvis has been transparent in his actions. AD's recent premature lifting of his suspension was done fully in secret, with no notification either before or after it occurred.

Why?


Holy shit! After pages and pages from you condemning me asking for a reason for AD's banning, now you feel you deserve an explanation from our mods for his return? truly fucked up. Be glad I don't go back and shove your response to me right back down your throat.

Can you tell who I really do not like here? You, dude, it's only you.


I am at a loss. No idea what you're referencing here, Iam. Whatever issues I had [and continue to have] with AD's M.O., I was FAR FROM ALONE in that sentiment, so not sure why you're targeting me specifically.

I have no dislike for you -- I don't know you personally. As I said before, I don't know anyone here personally. My objections here have been clear, and are in line with the objections shared by others. None of these objections are personal in nature, but rather, speak specifically to disruptive activities (thread proliferation/flooding, misrepresentations of intent, casting aspersions, misframing, etc.), not to mention the indiscriminate copy/pasting of reams of what amount to State-sponsored propaganda.

EDIT 1: IAM, you typed: "After pages and pages from you condemning me asking for a reason for AD's banning, now you feel you deserve an explanation from our mods for his return?" This is a false equivalence. Elvis EXPLAINED why AD got banned, and the reasons for AD being banned at the time was made clear not only by the mod, but by other members as well. It was ALL THERE for anyone to look up and review. In THIS INSTANCE, a mod did NOT provide a reason for lifting AD's suspension. There was no notice whatsoever about it. Clear now?

EDIT 2: -- cross-posting Alloneword's posting below, as it crystallizes the issues alluded in my comments above. If you choose to reply, Iam, please address the below as well.

alloneword » Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:21 pm wrote:Well, so just WTF IS going on? I've waited a while before commenting on this issue as I want to make fairly sure I'm aware of the facts before offering an opinion.

The facts (as I see them, but please do correct me if I'm wrong) are:

  • 82_28 largely abdicated responsibility as a moderator, absent for over 9 months, bar a single brief appearance (*see below).
  • Elvis, the remaining active moderator, made a decision to ban a poster who has a long history of what was considered to be disruptive behaviour.
  • 82_28 then decides to reinstate this poster - without consulting with Elvis.
  • 82_28 then decides (at the behest of this first poster, again without consulting Elvis) to reinstate yet another poster - also considered disruptive - who had previously been banned by Elvis.
  • This second poster being the self same one as had been briefly reinstated* by 82_28 previously (again, without consultation?) following his initial ban by Elvis back in December, only to be promptly re-banned again.

Elvis » Mon Oct 07, 2019 9:36 pm wrote:From the beginning I tried to consult with my my fellow moderator, seeking his advice, perspective and moral support before taking any action; I got no help. I was told, "You are a mod" and to do as I saw fit. Then my fellow moderator disappeared for months, putting all moderator responsibilities on me. Yes, I attempted to contact him last December, but I received no reply.

I always said what I was doing and why I was doing it, and sometimes public discussion preceded any action taken. The recent actions of my fellow moderator, in concert with a small but vocal group, were all done in secret.

Further, when Jeff was drawn into this, I was given no opportunity to represent myself or defend my actions. It was all done secretly.


Now, 82_28, you speak of 'respect'.

So where is the 'respect' in that?

It's my opinion is that your behaviour in this matter has been profoundly disrespectful, to the community here, but particularly towards Elvis, who has acted with integrity throughout.

(I'm not particularly sorry if you (82) feel that this 'CORNER[s you] IN A PERSONAL WAY', since you, by your actions, put yourself in this corner).

-

In answer to the question in the OP:

Jack, you are spot on: "This is about how the hegemony of State Department and corporate media propaganda has been achieved on this board: through incessant flooding and thread proliferation conducted mainly by two usernames."

If you do this, if you willingly disseminate State Department and corporate media propaganda, gleefully echoing their talking points and giving credence to their paranoid fantasies, then you really are no better than them. You are doing their bidding. You are actually helping the Global corporate elite in their war on the rest of us. So fuck you.

If you facilitate, tolerate or enable this, you are helping to condemn generations to come to live under the very thing (yeah, the other 'F' word) most of you profess to be fighting against. So fuck you, too.

The 'battle' here isn't about bullshit left/right, lib/dem or pro/anti Trump issues.

It's about those who like (or would like us) to conform to these false establishment sanctioned lines crap-flooding and drowning out everything else, including those who are seeking to expose whatever has it's hand up the arse of the all the puppets in this global Punch and Judy show.

Oh, while I'm at it: you're also right on the money regarding the (textbook passive-aggressive) claims of 'victimhood' and 'bullying' every time they are called on it. The only thing I find almost as nauseating as this behaviour itself is the willingness of otherwise seemingly rational minds to get sucked in by it, becoming 'enablers'.

I really don't care if your cat died or you have Chlamydia or you just found out you're 1/1024th cro-magnon, it has no bearing on what I think of your behaviour. Show some respect. For yourself, for the rest of us and for the dead fucking cat, and don't try to use the poor creature's demise in order to deflect criticism of your behaviour on a message board. Because that's just sick.
Last edited by Belligerent Savant on Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:03 pm, edited 3 times in total.
User avatar
Belligerent Savant
 
Posts: 5587
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:58 pm
Location: North Atlantic.
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby Harvey » Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:20 pm

Iawia, Every single time anyone ever asked authority to account for itself, the interlocuter becomes the focus of attention. One of those iron laws.
And while we spoke of many things, fools and kings
This he said to me
"The greatest thing
You'll ever learn
Is just to love
And be loved
In return"


Eden Ahbez
User avatar
Harvey
 
Posts: 4202
Joined: Mon May 09, 2011 4:49 am
Blog: View Blog (20)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:25 pm

Rigorous Intuition is own by Jeff Wells we all post here because of him he is giving you this space
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
User avatar
seemslikeadream
 
Posts: 32090
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:28 pm
Location: into the black
Blog: View Blog (83)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby Harvey » Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:29 pm

If Jeff participated once in a while I feel comfortable in predicting he'd modify his view.
And while we spoke of many things, fools and kings
This he said to me
"The greatest thing
You'll ever learn
Is just to love
And be loved
In return"


Eden Ahbez
User avatar
Harvey
 
Posts: 4202
Joined: Mon May 09, 2011 4:49 am
Blog: View Blog (20)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:31 pm

He pays the bills
He could shut down this place tomorrow
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
User avatar
seemslikeadream
 
Posts: 32090
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:28 pm
Location: into the black
Blog: View Blog (83)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby Belligerent Savant » Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:33 pm

.

seemslikeadream » Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:25 pm wrote:Rigorous Intuition is own by Jeff Wells we all post here because of him he is giving you this space


Why are you so desperate to prevent this collective expression? The horses have left the barn already and you're frantically -- fruitlessly -- trying to lure them back in. Let this be expressed. Your repeated refrains and call-outs to Lord Jeff can't stop it now.

Also, what Harvey said:

Harvey » Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:29 pm wrote:If Jeff participated once in a while I feel comfortable in predicting he'd modify his view.


--------------------------------------------.

seemslikeadream » Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:31 pm wrote:He could shut down this place tomorrow


Indeed he can.
User avatar
Belligerent Savant
 
Posts: 5587
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:58 pm
Location: North Atlantic.
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby Iamwhomiam » Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:19 pm

@BS

Rhetoric and the art of Collaborative Discussion

http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?p=668101#p668101 (Page 33)

In future, I hope our mods will post notice of all suspensions in the Members Notice Board which is linked to in our RI Index page, as well as the rule violation prompting the action.


http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?p=668372#p668372 (Page 35)

I'm feelin all warm and buzzy inside. Thanks for recognizing me as somebody, Elvis. It is much appreciated to have the reason for member suspensions and bans posted to the Members Notice Board. Hopefully, you'll soon explain there why American Dream has been suspended for a year. Please note I've read your earlier announcement of his being suspended. I've rarely read AD's material, as much of the material he posts is of little interest to me. Nevertheless, I haven't missed criticism tossed his way, as his critics have made that impossible. Frankly, I don't know if any of the scurrilous allegations lodged against AD are in any way valid, so if any are, (being a rule breaker), please let us know what rule(s) was/were broken.


http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?p=668378#p668378

Belligerent Savant, on page 35 wrote:
I'd suggest those questioning mod decisions apply a measure of trust the mods are taking actions in good faith, based on their best judgment. If anything, they've demonstrated a willingness to revisit and revise actions taken


You can easily follow our 'discussion' from here to its end.
User avatar
Iamwhomiam
 
Posts: 6572
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2007 2:47 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

Re: Thread for Elvis

Postby Iamwhomiam » Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:25 pm

Harvey » Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:20 pm wrote:Iawia, Every single time anyone ever asked authority to account for itself, the interlocuter becomes the focus of attention. One of those iron laws.

Thanks, Harvey. My brain doesn't work so well these days. Interlocutor, btw.
User avatar
Iamwhomiam
 
Posts: 6572
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2007 2:47 am
Blog: View Blog (0)

PreviousNext

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 165 guests