Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby cptmarginal » Sun Oct 20, 2019 7:31 pm

I don't always agree with American Dream either, even on the topic of Syria in particular - but I can pull up countless examples of great contributions by him that make it seem absurd to see such hostility and anger directed his way. And to rely on personal attacks and agent baiting really seems childish. Both to myself (someone who potentially disagrees strongly with AD on Syria) or to any outside observer. A self-defeating waste of time.

What an embarrassment, to purposely flout what we all know is a friendly rule here (no agent baiting) and thereby place some personal emotional burden on a moderator over issues that are very much impersonal and distant. I want MORE disagreement, not less; in my mind this is why the forum guidelines were created in the first place. So that we can continue debates without getting stuck on petty personal needs and hangups, as per the request of the owner:

Jeff wrote:The charge or insinuation of "disinfo agent" can almost never be proven, and poisons and often ends meaningful discussion. Therefore suggesting a poster is purposefully spreading disinformation is not permitted.

Please refrain from personal attacks, and keep arguments issue-based.

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Never mind this followup guideline, we gave up on it:

Jeff wrote:Please refrain from directing obscenities towards other board members in the body of the post.


:lol:
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby Grizzly » Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:57 am

Speaking of Sibel Edmonds ... I'll repost this here from my the real Syria thread post
http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=33717&p=679737#p679737
https://twitter.com/sibeledmonds/status/1185876022241181696
Sibel Edmonds, Obama era whistleblower warns of major incoming "isis false flag" attacks---!!!!!
https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/com ... _warns_of/

Gladio indeed...
https://twitter.com/hashtag/OperationGladioB?src=hash


Even an update...

Image

And latest...
Image
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby American Dream » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:38 pm

The Real Trouble With Tulsi

Hillary Clinton is wrong again. Gabbard is no Russian asset but a narrow nationalist.

By Jeet Heer

Image
Presidential candidate Tulsi Gabbard wears a flag pin.

But as Branco Marcetic noted in an acute critique in Jacobin, Gabbard’s opposition to a particular style of war doesn’t make her anti-war. Rather than large-scale invasions, Gabbard believes in fighting wars using drones and small commando units carrying out assassinations. “In short, when it comes to the war against terrorists, I’m a hawk,” Gabbard told a newspaper in 2018. “When it comes to counterproductive wars of regime change, I’m a dove.” As Marcetic notes, “Gabbard is offering nationalism in antiwar garb, reinforcing instead of undercutting the toxic rhetoric that treats foreigners as less deserving of dignity than Americans.”

Gabbard’s hawkish nationalism, with a strong undercurrent of Islamophobia, has manifested itself in many forms. Like the reactionary right, she frames the problem of terrorism in religious terms and mocked Barack Obama for his refusal to say “radical Islamic terrorism.” Gabbard opposed the Iran nuclear deal. She’s worked to limit the number of Muslim refugees America takes in. She’s also celebrated authoritarian leaders who have cracked down on political Islam, ranging from Egyptian dictator Abdel Fattah el-Sisi to Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi.

These are all positions that bring her in alignment with the Trumpian right, a congruence she has occasionally pursued by trying to work with reactionaries. In the early days of the Trump administration, she met with the president and there was talk of her being offered a position in his government. Erstwhile Trump adviser Steven Bannon talked up Gabbard, saying he “loves her” and “she gets the foreign policy stuff, the Islamic terrorism stuff.” The rumored position never materialized, but she was clearly more open to engaging with Trump than were almost all other Democrats.


https://www.thenation.com/article/clint ... i-gabbard/
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby stickdog99 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:49 pm

Synopsis: No brand of military isolationism will be tolerated!
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby Joe Hillshoist » Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:29 pm

cptmarginal » 21 Oct 2019 09:31 wrote:I don't always agree with American Dream either, even on the topic of Syria in particular - but I can pull up countless examples of great contributions by him that make it seem absurd to see such hostility and anger directed his way. And to rely on personal attacks and agent baiting really seems childish. Both to myself (someone who potentially disagrees strongly with AD on Syria) or to any outside observer. A self-defeating waste of time.

What an embarrassment, to purposely flout what we all know is a friendly rule here (no agent baiting) and thereby place some personal emotional burden on a moderator over issues that are very much impersonal and distant. I want MORE disagreement, not less; in my mind this is why the forum guidelines were created in the first place. So that we can continue debates without getting stuck on petty personal needs and hangups, as per the request of the owner:



AD's been on the outer here since the TIDS thread at least.

He posts stuff that makes people question their assumptions about their belief systems. Nobody likes that sort of thing.

I don't agree with everything he posts but in the interests of intellectual rigor he's certainly made me challenge some of my own assumptions and my brain is better for it.

i don't post or even lurk here much any more but I appreciate the stuff AD and SLAD have posted even when its mainstream crap. You can learn from that stuff too.
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby seemslikeadream » Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:39 pm

thank you it takes guts these days to say anything positive about me if one does they become a target (6 of those targets have left)
since there is no moderation here at the present it is gang bullying at its finest, anyone that disagrees with the Fab Four shall be silenced one way or another, rules are not being enforced and things are getting really ugly...and I am being "investigated" after being a member here for 14 years

elfismiles has also been concerned but he is being ignored also


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viewtopic.php?f=45&t=41863

elfismiles » Sat Oct 19, 2019 10:14 am wrote:
MacCruiskeen » 19 Oct 2019 14:26 wrote:You are a spook.


The charge or insinuation of "disinfo agent" can almost never be proven, and poisons and often ends meaningful discussion. Therefore suggesting a poster is purposefully spreading disinformation is not permitted.

Please read: guidelines for posting on the RI board
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http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/view ... =36&t=8705
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby Belligerent Savant » Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:26 pm

.

Joe Hillshoist » Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:29 pm wrote:
i don't post or even lurk here much any more but I appreciate the stuff AD and SLAD have posted even when its mainstream crap. You can learn from that stuff too.



While I appreciate the spirit of your sentiment, your quip also reveals a key factor/disclaimer: you barely even lurk here anymore, let alone post semi-regularly. As such, your commentary is understandable, but also lacking in crucial context. Moreover, it was never about the stuff/crap AD and SLAD post here, per se; it's the SHEER DAILY VOLUME of the Establishment State Propaganda reproduced with nary a semblance of discernment. This is an important distinction.

This right here sums it up about as well as any other synopsis offered of late:

JackRiddler » Mon Oct 21, 2019 10:01 am wrote:
We are talking about the wholesale, loving reproduction of corporate propaganda articles in toto, in real time, with daily proliferation of new thread titles and in 25-screen posts on every other thread -- obviously designed to flood all alternate points of view out of view and guarantee that no one incidentally browsing this board will ever see anything other than a majority of this propaganda, until they leave. It is as though someone wanted to create a fandom site for Google News aggregator. It is the effective neutralization of this place either as a place for alternate views or as a place where any discussion can take place. What is the purpose of this?
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby Joe Hillshoist » Wed Oct 23, 2019 4:35 am

Belligerent Savant wrote:.



While I appreciate the spirit of your sentiment, your quip also reveals a key factor/disclaimer: you barely even lurk here anymore, let alone post semi-regularly. As such, your commentary is understandable, but also lacking in crucial context. Moreover, it was never about the stuff/crap AD and SLAD post here, per se; it's the SHEER DAILY VOLUME of the Establishment State Propaganda reproduced with nary a semblance of discernment. This is an important distinction.



True. I'm often not here for months on end but I still check in at least once or twice a week for over half the year just to see what people's take on things is. So its not like I'm never here.

It doesn't look that different than its ever looked, just in terms of threads who started them etc etc. There's always been a mix of mainstream and non mainstream sources here.

It doesn't seem like its being bombarded with stuff with any particular agenda.

Right now in GD the top 10 posts are pretty varied. AD has started 2 and posted last in both of them - the topic is Evola and modern fascist mysticism - hardly mainstream and always a part of this site's remit.

Mind you I read this site on a desktop and alot of what I hear in the complaints about SLAD seem to be with the way mobile devices put up all new posts. So I don't have that issue.

In all seriouslyness the only cure for that is to drink daily glasses of cement and harden the fuck up... :cheers: It a bit of a first world problem.

I find it really sad.

Everyone here is better than these petty squabbles.
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby MacCruiskeen » Wed Oct 23, 2019 7:32 am

Joe Hillshoist » Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:29 pm wrote:
cptmarginal » 21 Oct 2019 09:31 wrote:I don't always agree with American Dream either, even on the topic of Syria in particular - but I can pull up countless examples of great contributions by him that make it seem absurd to see such hostility and anger directed his way. And to rely on personal attacks and agent baiting really seems childish. Both to myself (someone who potentially disagrees strongly with AD on Syria) or to any outside observer. A self-defeating waste of time.

What an embarrassment, to purposely flout what we all know is a friendly rule here (no agent baiting) and thereby place some personal emotional burden on a moderator over issues that are very much impersonal and distant. I want MORE disagreement, not less; in my mind this is why the forum guidelines were created in the first place. So that we can continue debates without getting stuck on petty personal needs and hangups, as per the request of the owner:



AD's been on the outer here since the TIDS thread at least.

He posts stuff that makes people question their assumptions about their belief systems. Nobody likes that sort of thing.


Bullshit. What assumptions? He posts acre upon acre upon acre of warmongering crap under a pseudo-left facade, and then he flatly refuses ever to discuss any of it with anyone.

I don't agree with everything he posts but in the interests of intellectual rigor he's certainly made me challenge some of my own assumptions and my brain is better for it.


What assumptions, exactly, has he made you change? How, exactly, has American Dream improved your brain? Your claim is completely empty.

i don't post or even lurk here much any more but I appreciate the stuff AD and SLAD have posted even when its mainstream crap. You can learn from that stuff too.


"Appreciate" - again completely empty. What, exactly, have you learned from the "mainstream crap" (your words) regurgitated en masse by the Two Dreams to RI? How do those torrents of crap add value to Rigorous Intuition General Discussion?

Joe, you're one of many valued posters who had more-or-less completely vanished from this Discussion Board Data Dump, and it is good to see your name here again. But this is just bone-lazy stuff from you. (The same applies in spades to cptmarginal's effort, a giant nothingburger lobbed from the sidelines by a disgruntled consumer. Bad form.)
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby MacCruiskeen » Wed Oct 23, 2019 7:51 am

31,855 posts wrote:you can read with your own eyes the front page of GD it is nothing like the lies they are promoting


American Drone is keeping a lower-than-usual profile until it's safe to come out again, and you have toned it down only because of the massive resistance your torrents of copypasted mainstream crap finally provoked.

You know this. You are chronically and now notoriously dishonest.
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby brainpanhandler » Wed Oct 23, 2019 10:43 am

OK. I'm paying attention now.
"Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." - Martin Luther King Jr.
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby Joe Hillshoist » Thu Oct 24, 2019 3:16 am

MacCruiskeen » 23 Oct 2019 21:32 wrote:
Bullshit. What assumptions? He posts acre upon acre upon acre of warmongering crap under a pseudo-left facade, and then he flatly refuses ever to discuss any of it with anyone.
What assumptions, exactly, has he made you change? How, exactly, has American Dream improved your brain? Your claim is completely empty.


That WOO is subject to political manip[ulation. That right wing cunts have their fingers in all sorts of things people like me, who question neo Liberalism, neo conservatism and whatever dominant narratives are shoved down our throat by self interested arseholes, identify with. That alot of ideas I unquestioningly took as simply spirituality were nasty propaganda or could lead that way,

One of the reasons I still regularly look in here atm are his threads with Evola in the titles.

"Appreciate" - again completely empty. What, exactly, have you learned from the "mainstream crap" (your words) regurgitated en masse by the Two Dreams to RI? How do those torrents of crap add value to Rigorous Intuition General Discussion?


OK - Indo Stonehenge thread, the Snowden one and Snowden one especially lately because its a good source. SLAD is a good aggregator iof stuff even if you don't agree with it. There is value in that. Especially lately I use some of her posts as a way to access mainstream propaganda that is put together well.

Remember the other RI Dream(s) that Ended? I am old enough to be sentimental about more Dreams Ending.

Joe, you're one of many valued posters who had more-or-less completely vanished from this Discussion Board Data Dump, and it is good to see your name here again. But this is just bone-lazy stuff from you. (The same applies in spades to cptmarginal's effort, a giant nothingburger lobbed from the sidelines by a disgruntled consumer. Bad form.)


I've got three kids under 10 and will be 50 in three or four days. Sorry RI - I'm near the end (not really just old) and I just don't have the time.

I don't keep up with stuff the way I used to.

I think there's a few of us who've disappeared cos of kids.


I think you mob are doing what i do with my kids. The more they do something annoying the less tolerance I have for it even when they are going out of their way to not be as much of PITAs as they were being.
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby Marionumber1 » Thu Oct 24, 2019 9:20 am

More evidence from the same aforementioned author, Nafeez Ahmed, that the US govvernment was tacitly approving the sponsorship of Islamic terrorists in Syria by its allies (or under the framework of Operation Cyclone, Operation Gladio B, and the lead-up to the 9/11 attacks, its cutouts):

Nafeez Ahmed, "ISIS was state-sponsored by US allies, says former government intelligence analyst (EXCLUSIVE)", 2017/11/03 wrote:Contrary to conventional wisdom, the peer-reviewed paper published in the Routledge journal Studies in Conflict and Terrorism in July, confirms not only that several regional states deliberately empowered al-Qaeda and ISIS foreign fighters for their geopolitical ends, but that many of these states are ostensibly US allies in the ‘war on terror’: including Turkey, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia.


Byman’s analysis corroborates my previous reporting on evidence that Turkey, Saudi Arabia and other Gulf states have at various times supported Islamist militant groups in Syria, including al-Qaeda in Iraq, which went on to metamorphose into ISIS.

Two years ago, a declassified Pentagon intelligence report from 2012 revealed not only that the US government had been aware of the policy of its allies at the time, but seemed to approve of the strategy despite anticipating that it might culminate in the appearance of an IS-type entity.


Far from merely being caught up in its own unfortunate “dilemma” — being forced to rely on states that support terror to fight terror — they argue that the US policy of tolerating allied “support for jihadist foreign fighters” is due to dubious foreign policy interests.

INSIGHT: According to Charles Shoebridge, a former British Army and Metropolitan Police counter-terrorism intelligence officer, British authorities failed to prevent UK citizens from “joining jihadist groups in Libya and Syria” not because of inadequate security powers, but due to their perceived geopolitical utility at the time.

The ‘blind eye’ policy, Shoebridge told me, was consistent with the UK government position at the time of supporting rebel groups in Libya and Syria in attempting to “topple Gaddafi and Assad.”


This self-defeating strategy in Libya and Syria went well beyond simply turning a blind eye, however.

Alastair Crooke, a former 30 year senior MI6 officer who dealt with Islamist groups across the Muslim world, told INSURGE that, at the time, the US and Britain actively facilitated their allies’ sponsorship of militants in Syria.

“When the US and British militaries were working with the Turks to train various Syrian rebel groups, many military officers knew that among those we were training was the next round of jihadists,” said Crooke. “But the CIA was fixated on regime change. We knew that even if at any moment ISIS was eventually defeated, these Islamist groups would move against secular and moderate forces.”
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby American Dream » Thu Oct 24, 2019 9:39 am

I don't doubt that Uncle Sam and various allies (Saudi Arabia, the U.K., the Gulf States etc.) have supported certain islamic fundamentalist militant tendencies in various places and times. This though is not synonymous to me with a monolithic conspiracy nor (necessarily) with the existence of "Gladio B", as described by Sibel Edmonds.

There was a time when I accepted Edmonds' claims uncritically and did believe. I am not rejecting them out of hand. It's more that I consider her thesis essentially uncorroborated, even though there are plenty of "true facts" regarding the nexus between jihadi warriors and spooks.
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Re: Tulsi Gabbard Is No ‘Progressive’ on Foreign Policy

Postby seemslikeadream » Fri Oct 25, 2019 9:15 am

‘I Will Not Be Seeking Reelection to Congress in 2020’ Says Tulsi Gabbard – Hours After Appearing on Fox News
By David BadashOctober 25, 2019 at 12:42 AM ET
U.S. Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-HI) has just announced she will not run for re-election to Congress, instead choosing to devote herself to her presidential campaign.

Gabbard becomes just the sixth Democrat this term to leave office or announce they will be leaving office at the end of their term. The late Chairman Elijah Cummings (D-MD) was the fifth.

The Hawaii Democratic Congresswoman just days ago battled former Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton, who suggested she is being groomed by the Republicans to run as a third party candidate. Gabbard, replying to erroneous news reports based on reporting from The New York Times, blasted Clinton for suggesting she is a Russian asset.

But Gabbard also promised at the time she would only run as a Democrat and would not run for president as a third party candidate.


Tulsi Gabbard

@TulsiGabbard
· 9h
Replying to @TulsiGabbard
... end our interventionist foreign policy of being the world’s police, toppling dictators and governments we don’t like, and redirect our precious resources towards serving the needs of the people here at home ...

Tulsi Gabbard

@TulsiGabbard
I'm fully committed to my offer to serve you, the people of Hawaii & America, as your President & Commander-in-Chief. So I will not be seeking reelection to Congress in 2020. I humbly ask for your support for my candidacy for President of the United States http://tulsi.to/mahalo
Aunty Pilahi Paki said: “The world will turn to Hawaii as they search for world peace because Hawaii has the key … and that key is Aloha!”
Mahalo, Hawaiʻi - Tulsi Gabbard
Aunty Pilahi Paki said: “The world will turn to Hawaii as they search for world peace because Hawaii has the key … and that key is Aloha!”
tulsi2020.com

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Gabbard is currently polling in the low single digits, with an average of 1.3%.

Thursday night she appeared on Fox News’ “Hannity,” parroting GOP talking points, but did not make her announcement until later:


Acyn Torabi
@Acyn
Tulsi Gabbard appears on Hannity and criticizes the impeachment inquiry process by saying she doesn’t know what’s going on behind closed doors and that she wants transparency
Embedded video

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https://www.thenewcivilrightsmovement.c ... -fox-news/
Mazars and Deutsche Bank could have ended this nightmare before it started.
They could still get him out of office.
But instead, they want mass death.
Don’t forget that.
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