Kubrick

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'The Gaze' in EWS...

Postby morganwolf » Wed Dec 07, 2005 3:41 pm

Except for the parts in quotations, all of this is my own explication.<br><br>In our discussion of EWS, it is useful to consider the importance of what John Berger ( Ways of Seeing 1972) calls 'the gaze.' I had to read Berger for a film studies class years ago, and read Susan Sontag's On Photography for my visual anthropology class. I have to say that these works were, if you'll forgive the pun, eye opening.<br><br>Berger has a lot to say about how women view films that depict female nudity. The female spectator is 'conflicted' because she must 1) identify with the object of the gaze 2) must position herself as a male spectator in order to appreciate the traditional frontal nude representations inherent to post-Renaissance art.<br><br>Think about yourselves as spectators and how you reacted to this film. It's likely that the males had different reactions that the females. Think about the subjective experience of film viewing. Did you identify with Alice or Bill? Or both? Just interesting questions that encourage self-reflection. There are many ways to read this film. Kubrick probably thought about most of them, but each of sees what we want to see in this film. This is true of all visual representations. By virtue of the gaze's subjectivity, viewers 'see' with their eyes wide shut. We are doomed to make meaning according to what anthropologist Clifford Geertz termed our personal, albeit intricately woven, 'webs of significance.' That's a fwiw statement. Fwiw. <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START ;) --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/wink.gif ALT=";)"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <br><br>Back to the film and the power of the gaze.<br><br>Here are some text quotes from Berger and Sontag. My comments follow.<br><br>------------------<br>Notes on 'The Gaze'<br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.aber.ac.uk/media/Documents/gaze/gaze08.html">www.aber.ac.uk/media/Docu...aze08.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>In Ways of Seeing, a highly influential book based on a BBC television series, John Berger observed that ‘according to usage and conventions which are at last being questioned but have by no means been overcome - men act and women appear. Men look at women. Women watch themselves being looked at’ (Berger 1972, 45, 47). Berger argues that in European art from the Renaissance onwards women were depicted as being ‘aware of being seen by a [male] spectator’ (ibid., 49), <br><br>Berger adds that at least from the seventeenth century, paintings of female nudes reflected the woman’s submission to ‘the owner of both woman and painting’ (ibid., 52). He noted that ‘almost all post-Renaissance European sexual imagery is frontal - either literally or metaphorically - because the sexual protagonist is the spectator-owner looking at it’ (ibid., 56). He advanced the idea that the realistic, ‘highly tactile’ depiction of things in oil paintings and later in colour photography (in particular where they were portrayed as ‘within touching distance’), represented a desire to possess the things (or the lifestyle) depicted (ibid., 83ff). This also applied to women depicted in this way (ibid., 92). <br><br>Writing in 1972, Berger insisted that women were still ‘depicted in a different way to men - because the "ideal" spectator is always assumed to be male and the image of the woman is designed to flatter him’ (ibid., 64). In 1996 Jib Fowles still felt able to insist that ‘in advertising males gaze, and females are gazed at’ (Fowles 1996, 204). And Paul Messaris notes that female models in ads addressed to women ‘treat the lens as a substitute for the eye of an imaginary male onlooker,’ adding that ‘it could be argued that when women look at these ads, they are actually seeing themselves as a man might see them’ (Messaris 1997, 41). Such ads ‘appear to imply a male point of view, even though the intended viewer is often a woman. So the women who look at these ads are being invited to identify both with the person being viewed and with an implicit, opposite-sex viewer’ (ibid., 44).<br><br>We may note that within this dominant representational tradition the spectator is typically assumed not simply to be male but also to be heterosexual, over the age of puberty and often also white. <br>-------------<br>Notes on 'The Gaze' - Daniel Chandler<br>The eye of the camera<br><br>Looking at someone using a camera (or looking at images thus produced) is clearly different from looking at the same person directly. Indeed, the camera frequently enables us to look at people whom we would never otherwise see at all. In a very literal sense, the camera turns the depicted person into an object, distancing viewer and viewed. <br><br>We are all familiar with anecdotes about the fears of primal tribes that 'taking' a photograph of them may also take away their souls, but most of us have probably felt on some occasions that we don't want 'our picture' taken. In controlling the image, the photographer (albeit temporarily) has power over those in front of the lens, a power which may also be lent to viewers of the image. In this sense, the camera can represent a 'controlling gaze'. <br><br>In her classic book, On Photography Susan Sontag referred to several aspects of 'photographic seeing' which are relevant in the current context (Sontag 1979, 89): <br><br>-- 'To photograph is to appropriate the thing photographed' (ibid., 4)<br><br>-- 'Photographing is essentially an act of non-intervention... The act of photographing is more than passive observing. Like sexual voyeurism, it is a way of at least tacitly, often explicitly, encouraging what is going on to keep on happening' (ibid., 11-12); <br><br>-- 'The camera doesn't rape, or even possess, though it may presume, intrude, trespass, distort, exploit, and, at the farthest reach of metaphor, assassinate - all activities that, unlike the sexual push and shove, can be conducted from a distance, and with some detachment' (ibid., 13). <br><br>The functions of photography can be seen in the context of Michel Foucault's analysis of the rise of surveillance in modern society. Photography promotes 'the normalizing gaze, a surveillance that makes it possible to qualify, to classify and to punish. It establishes over individuals a visibility through which one differentiates and judges them' (Foucault 1977, 25). Photography was used in the second half of the nineteenth century to identify prisoners, mental patients and racial types (Tagg 198<!--EZCODE EMOTICON START 8) --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/glasses.gif ALT="8)"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> . However, looking need not necessarily be equated with controlling (Lutz & Collins 1994, 365). <br><br>Film theorists argue that in order to 'suspend one's disbelief' and to become drawn into a conventional narrative when watching a film one must first 'identify with' the camera itself as if it were one's own eyes and thus accept the viewpoint offered (this is, for instance, an assumption made by Mulvey 1975). Whilst one has little option but to accept the locational viewpoint of the film-maker, to suggest that one is obliged to accept the preferred reading involves treating viewers as uniformly passive, making no allowance for 'negotiation' on their part. There are many modes of engagement with film, as with other media. <br><br>The film theorist Christian Metz made an analogy between the cinema screen and a mirror (Metz 1975), arguing that through identifying with the gaze of the camera, the cinema spectator re-enacts what the psychoanalytic theorist Jacques Lacan called 'the mirror stage', a stage at which looking into the mirror allows the infant to see itself for the first time as other - a significant step in ego formation. Extending this observation to still photography, Catherine Lutz and Jane Collins observe that 'mirror and camera are tools of self-reflection and surveillance. Each creates a double of the self, a second figure who can be examined more closely than the original - a double that can also be alienated from the self - taken away, as a photograph can be, to another place' (Lutz & Collins 1994, 376). <!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.aber.ac.uk/media/Documents/gaze/gaze06.html">www.aber.ac.uk/media/Docu...aze06.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br>-------------------<br>Laura Mulvey did not undertake empirical studies of actual filmgoers, but declared her intention to make ‘political use’ of Freudian psychoanalytic theory (in a version influenced by Jacques Lacan) in a study of cinematic spectatorship. Such psychoanalytically-inspired studies of 'spectatorship' focus on how 'subject positions' are constructed by media texts rather than investigating the viewing practices of individuals in specific social contexts. Mulvey notes that Freud had referred to (infantile) scopophilia - the pleasure involved in looking at other people’s bodies as (particularly, erotic) objects.<br><br>In the darkness of the cinema auditorium it is notable that one may look without being seen either by those on screen by other members of the audience. Mulvey argues that various features of cinema viewing conditions facilitate for the viewer both the voyeuristic process of objectification of female characters and also the narcissistic process of identification with an ‘ideal ego’ seen on the screen. She declares that in patriarchal society ‘pleasure in looking has been split between active/male and passive/female’ (Mulvey 1992, 27). This is reflected in the dominant forms of cinema.<br><br>Conventional narrative films in the ‘classical’ Hollywood tradition not only typically focus on a male protagonist in the narrative but also assume a male spectator. ‘As the spectator identifies with the main male protagonist, he projects his look onto that of his like, his screen surrogate, so that the power of the male protagonist as he controls events coincides with the active power of the erotic look, both giving a satisfying sense of omnipotence’ (ibid., 2<!--EZCODE EMOTICON START 8) --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/glasses.gif ALT="8)"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> .<br><br>Traditional films present men as active, controlling subjects and treat women as passive objects of desire for men in both the story and in the audience, and do not allow women to be desiring sexual subjects in their own right. Such films objectify women in relation to ‘the controlling male gaze’ (ibid., 33), presenting ‘woman as image’ (or ‘spectacle’) and man as ‘bearer of the look’ (ibid., 27). Men do the looking; women are there to be looked at. The cinematic codes of popular films ‘are obsessively subordinated to the neurotic needs of the male ego’ (ibid., 33). It was Mulvey who coined the term 'the male gaze'. <br><br>See Laura Mulvey (feminist film theorist) on 'The Gaze':<br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.aber.ac.uk/media/Documents/gaze/gaze09.html">www.aber.ac.uk/media/Docu...aze09.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br>--------------------------<br>My comments, using Berger as a way of making meaning --<br><br>Consider the power of Kidman's gaze as she appraises herself. In so doing, she subverts the traditional (as in post-Renaissance) role of the male spectator. The shots of her rear-end also subvert the relentless frontal nudity of the other female nudes in the film. Of all the women, she is the only one that appears to be in control of her body and how it is used -- except Domino, which I'll get to in a minute.<br><br>It's worth noting that it is Alice's gaze at her husband's flirtatious behavior, while she is dancing, that provokes most of the subsequent story line. Anticipating he is nearing that point of infidelity (revisiting Beethoven's operatic theme in Fidelio), the next night's pot smoking episode provokes her pent-up frustration with her husband, the breadwinner, who 'keeps' Alice in style while she figures out whether to return to another job. (Nod to whomever made the reference to Alice as just another prostitute, but she is respectable, in comparison to them, enjoying the social-economic distinction and privilege of marriage.)<br><br>During the argument, Bill sexually objectifies her, instead of being jealous of her near-miss with infidelity, with the waltzing Hungarian. Alice punishes him by recounting the (fictional?) story of the naval officer. Would she really have 'given up everything' for his one perfect guy, who may not exist? Her refusal to have sex with the Hungarian seems like a 'quaint' or 'outmoded' mindset when juxtaposed with Bill's mindset and post-party excesses.<br><br>More thoughts on Domino/Alice:<br><br>I see Domino as Alice's alter-ego, clad in animal furs, living in a wild, unprotected environment, pursuing her animalistic urges. I mentioned in a previous post that Alice must release her Domino self/shade/alter in order to satisfy her husbands growing hunger for the forbidden while, at the same time, retaining control over him and the tight structure of their marriage.<br><br>It is interesting that Bill makes the offer of money - that is one way to diminish Domino's power. From the moment they meet, Domino seems to be unwilling to take money. Is she pursuing Bill for her own sexual satisfaction? If so, she is in control. For that, she must be punished, as all 'loose' women are: she gets AIDS. (Hitchcock has been showing moviegoers what happens to sexually active women since Psycho, which imho, began the era of the slasher films.)<br><br>Also, do we all agree that Domino at the ritual? I'd say yes, but who knows?<br><br>Last night, I thought about the bizarre street assault scene, when the gang of thugs knock Bill against a parked car and call him a fag, or Mary. It appears to be another provocation to prove his sexual potency by engaging in risky, extra-marital behavior. Interesting that Alice interrupts her husband before he can consummate his evening with Domino. Her well-timed phone call rescues Harford from contracting AIDS. But he is still restless. Here, I again have to agree with Pants Elk again.<br><br>Nick Nightingale is the "devil" who tempts Bill (why else let him see the password and then give him the address to Somerset?). <br><br>Thinking back to what I found in Bullfinch's Mythology, Nick can be seen as the nightingale making ready to sing over the grave of Orpheus (Bill) who he does expect to survive after his visit to the Underworld. He does survive, but barely. Only by returning to Alice does Bill find redemption and rebirth. (One reading of many!)<br><br>Last thing - Ziegler's Party/Somerset: think about the light/dark dichotomy and the color scheme: gold and white (heavenly colors?) vs. red/black (hell/underworld colors)?<br><br>Subtext piles on subtext. I love it. Wonderful thread, people. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: 'The Gaze' in EWS...

Postby Sweejak » Wed Dec 07, 2005 5:04 pm

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Subtext piles on subtext. <hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--> Kubrick was a chess player and that is all about interlocking scenarios with the path to victory being pressed with a constellation of connections often arrived at intuitively.<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.krusch.com/kubrick/Q57.html">www.krusch.com/kubrick/Q57.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>"The chess pieces are the block alphabet which shapes thoughts; and these thoughts ... express their beauty abstractly.... I have come to the personal conclusion that while all artists are not chess players, all chess players are artists."<br> - Marcel Duchamp, 1887 - 1968<br><br>I have to run but thought I would drop this in as an FYI re: 2010<br><br><br>edit: fix link<br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://cyberspaceorbit.com/saturn/lpnew.htm">cyberspaceorbit.com/saturn/lpnew.htm</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=sweejak@rigorousintuition>Sweejak</A> at: 12/7/05 6:01 pm<br></i>
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Re: Old Nick

Postby monkeymcgee » Wed Dec 07, 2005 7:15 pm

[quoted]I always wondered why the movie was in 4:3 format. 4:3 "mirrored" (as everything is in this movie) is 3/4, the waltz-time. The movie opens with a waltz ...[/quoted]<br><br>Of course, 16:9 reduces to 4:3 as well, so not too sure that means much... <p></p><i></i>
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re: the gaze/icon & image

Postby hanshan » Wed Dec 07, 2005 10:31 pm

<br><br><!--EZCODE IMAGE START--><img src="http://www.pipelinenews.org/readerimages/scream.jpg" style="border:0;"/><!--EZCODE IMAGE END--><br><br><br><!--EZCODE LINK START--><a href="http://www.film-philosophy.com/vol3-1999/n30fairbairn" target="top"><!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>The Gaze and _Eyes Wide Shut_</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--></a><!--EZCODE LINK END--><br><br><br>PO Box 26161 <br>London SW8 4WD <br>England <br><br> Film-Philosophy<br> <br> Volume 3, 1999 <br><br><br><br>No. 30: Marty Fairbairn, The Gaze and Eyes Wide Shut <br><br><br>The film features two strong central performances that subtly capture the sexually repressed, emotionally alienated psyches of a modern, successful couple. Cruise's and (especially) Kidman's performances show us a superficial, self-deluded sensuality, yet manage to suggest that deeper passions bubble just below the surface. This 'successful' couple's happiness, like their sensuality, is only skin-deep. Kubrick's camera suggests his characters' duplicity by constantly flipping sides, showing us the same characters from two opposite directions.<br><br><!--EZCODE CENTER START--><div style="text-align:center">-****-</div><!--EZCODE CENTER END--><br><br><br>This is a film that operates on many levels: it is about the vagaries of adult sexual relationships, but it is also about voyeurism; it is about the fetish of looking, 'scopophilia', as well as the problem of being looked at; and, it is about the role of the 'image' in the postmodern world. Right from the start, Kubrick makes us accomplices in looking. The opening image of the film, inter-cut with the credits, is one of Alice/Nicole Kidman sliding out of her dress. This opening sets the tone for the film: Kubrick casts *us* in the role of voyeurs by casting America's most-watched couple in the lead roles of his film. We enjoy watching Alice and Bill watch themselves make love in front of a mirror (to the strains of Chris Isaac's 'Baby did a Bad, Bad Thing'). We also enjoy watching Tom Cruise and Nicole Kidman reveal *them*selves. This is perhaps the central image of the film and it operates simultaneously as sexual stimulant and cultural commentary. Within the film, it operates as a template for the powerful lure of the image, the superficial facade of things and the 'story', the fascination for which causes trouble between Bill and Alice Harford. Outside the film, it operates as a central example of the reason why this film, starring this couple, holds such interest for us: they are perhaps filmdom's most alluring couple. We are attracted to them; we want to look at them. (Indeed, the sequence even suggests that star images are a source of fascination *for the stars themselves*, but this takes us well beyond the scope of this review.) But images are a temptation, a trap into which we may fall at any time, a trap that resonates with Christian theology's history of ambivalence vis-a-vis the image as icon.<br><br><!--EZCODE CENTER START--><div style="text-align:center">-****-</div><!--EZCODE CENTER END--> <br><br>Eyes Wide Shut_ suggests that the more you look at something, the less you actually see. Looking is a type of flirtation, but there is a price to be paid for it. For Bill, the price is humiliation; for us, it is losing touch with our own sensuality by living our dreams through others'. The more we look at that which is private, intimate, the less able we are to deal with our own intimacy. But more than the role of the image is dealt with here. Kubrick suggests that the arts, especially the narrative arts such as film, have an important role to play in the self-conscious awareness of a culture. We tell stories to learn about ourselves. But we should never take the stories *themselves* for real. <br><br><!--EZCODE CENTER START--><div style="text-align:center">-****-</div><!--EZCODE CENTER END--><br><br><br>Similarly, film artists tell us stories and actors 'reveal themselves' to us, but none of it is real. Film directors play games, audiences participate. Through Sydney Pollack, Kubrick tells us 'It's all fake. None of it is real.' ('Just ignore the man behind the curtain.') It is not accidental that Kubrick casts Sydney Pollack, a well-known American film director, in the role of a rich manipulator who likes to watch the intimate sexual acts of strangers. Bill's reaction to Alice's story reminds us that stories can stimulate all manner of emotions; fear, sexual arousal, amusement, excitement, anger. (In the case of cinema, they sometimes send us reeling from the theatre, especially if the director is Stanley Kubrick.) Hence, film art, like the other narrative arts, is a force to be reckoned with. Like Gadamer's notion of 'play', narrative art is a serious game. It can change the way we view ourselves, even sometimes the way we live. But it is not real life. Real life is what we live every day.<br><br><!--EZCODE CENTER START--><div style="text-align:center">-****-</div><!--EZCODE CENTER END--><br><br><br> As much as it is a film about the vagaries of adult sexual relationships, it is a film about scopophilia and our obsession with the postmodern god, the Hollywood icon. <br><br><br><!--EZCODE CENTER START--><div style="text-align:center">-****-</div><!--EZCODE CENTER END--><br><br><br>Eyes Wide Shut_ is about people seduced by images, people who are so taken with the image that they forget the substance of the object of their gaze. Film directors/story-tellers -- not limited to, but perhaps especially Kubrick -- manipulate our emotions and play fast and loose with personal identity through temporarily blurring the distinction between dream and reality, art and real life.<br><br><br><!--EZCODE LINK START--><a href="http://www.film-philosophy.com/" target="top">www.film-philosophy.com/</a><!--EZCODE LINK END--><br><br><br><!--EZCODE FONT START--><span style="color:blue;font-family:comic sans ms;font-size:xx-small;">....</span><!--EZCODE FONT END--> <p></p><i></i>
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The 4/3 Waltz

Postby Pants Elk » Thu Dec 08, 2005 8:48 am

[quoted]I always wondered why the movie was in 4:3 format. 4:3 "mirrored" (as everything is in this movie) is 3/4, the waltz-time. The movie opens with a waltz ...[/quoted]<br><br>"Of course, 16:9 reduces to 4:3 as well, so not too sure that means much..."<br><br>Only in as much as 4:3 was a conscious - and unusual - artistic decision by Kubrick, so we must look at it closely, like all his decisions, unusual or otherwise. And given the recurring (reflecting) theme of mirrors in the movie, we can justifiably hold everything up to the "mirror": and I find 4:3 mirroring as 3/4 a nice coincidence, or piece of synchronicity, at worst. I'm not sure we should be looking for coincidence/synchroniscity in this movie. Kubrick's approach left very little room for chance.<br><br>Couple more thoughts: Dr Bill is not a real doctor. What do we see him doing in his capacity as doctor? Looking. Listening. Touching. At no point does he treat or heal any sickness. Yet he seems at unusual pains to convince everyone of his bonafides, showing his ID as if he were a cop (incidentally: "clown, officer, pilot" = C.O.P.)<br>He thinks he's a doctor, he believes he's a doctor, he's got the paperwork to prove it. He's a cop in a dream of being a doctor. He's showing his badge, he's walking the beat ...<br><br>At the masked ritual, he's recognised as being an outsider. How? The mask reveals rather than disguises him. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Kubrick knew what was down...

Postby listbox » Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:36 am

The scene everyone seems to be speculationg on was shot in the Rothschild mansion (Waddesdon Manor in Buckinghamshire, I think. <!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.churchwell.co.uk/waddesdon-manor.htm">www.churchwell.co.uk/waddesdon-manor.htm</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--> ).<br><br>That is no mere coincidence.<br><br>I don't think he was "done-in". Kubrick was clever - and as the story shows, he knew what was done to those who spilled the beans on the trillionaire satanist rulers. He waited to make this thing in the time he knew that he was leaving the world. It was his goodbye and warning. ther is not a scene out of place - despite being muddled with after his death by the criminal who's "Munich" is about to propagandize our screens, shortly. <p></p><i></i>
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How to put on a bra

Postby Col Quisp » Thu Dec 08, 2005 11:05 am

At some point in the film, Alice puts on her bra, but I don't know anyone who puts on the bra the way she does. She reaches around to her back to hook it. I've never done that in my life. I hook it in front and then slide it around back. It just struck me as "not right." Did anyone else notice this? I'm not trying to detract from the much more profound comments on this discussion, but it bothered me.<br> <p></p><i></i>
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Uh ...

Postby Pants Elk » Thu Dec 08, 2005 11:22 am

As hard as it is to get back on track after col quisp has planted that image in my mind ... where were we? Huh?<br><br>Oh yeah.<br><br>Since *everything* in this movie is doubled and reflected (over 40 instances of one character "parroting" another's last line, for example ...), I've been thinking about "Fidelio". We're TOLD that it's an opera, okay .. and the connection to the theme of marital (in)fidelity is explicit. In fact, it's what a lot of commentators take for the main theme of the movie; what it's about. But if we look at it in (Alice's) mirror, the reflection is <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>infidel</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END-->. That's what the movie is really about, not the surface play of extramarital affairs (as if <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>that</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> could ever interest Kubrick).<br><br>We're watching the infidels. The godless. Those with no faith in anything at all - except their own power to buy, and therefore possess, and therefore become - anything at all.<br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>EDIT: More "mirroring"<br><br>When Dr Bill goes to Somerton the first time, it's night, and he arrives from the right. The second time (why, incidentally?), it's day, and he arrives ... from the left.<br><br>The first time he returns home from Somerton, it's night, and he turns to the left as he enters his apartment. The second time, it's day, and he turns ... to the right.<br><br>Plus, the first time he comes home, look for the image of the eye projected onto his back. Stop-frame it to be sure - it's really there. They've got their eye on him, see ...</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--><br><br>No, I don't get out much - why do you ask? <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p216.ezboard.com/brigorousintuition.showUserPublicProfile?gid=pantselk>Pants Elk</A> at: 12/8/05 9:47 am<br></i>
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Re: How to put on a bra

Postby sunny » Thu Dec 08, 2005 1:12 pm

gee, Col Quisp, maybe I'm <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>not right</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END-->- I have always put on my bra the way Alice does, so I didn't give that particular scene a second thought.I have friends, and even my daughter, who do it the way you do, but I'm usually the odd girl out.<!--EZCODE EMOTICON START 8o --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/nerd.gif ALT="8o"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <p></p><i></i>
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re: ways of seeing

Postby hanshan » Thu Dec 08, 2005 3:43 pm

<br><br><!--EZCODE LINK START--><a href="http://www.nsu.newschool.edu/Immediacy/Past%20Immediacy/public_html/mix2000/roy.html" target="top"><!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>To Dream, To Die:<br>Stanley Kubrick’s Eyes Wide Shut</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--></a><!--EZCODE LINK END--> <br><br>Roy Brand<br><br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>According to Nietzsche, tragedy and the struggle it embodies reveals the very essence of reality. It discloses reality’s deepest, most concealed layers, which are governed by Dionysian forces of ecstatic transgression and Apollonian principles of formal order or representation. Nietzsche fervently calls for the renewal of that ancient conflict and warns against the modern split between these two dialectically opposed forces. Their coming together in tragedy is a symbol of the strong Hellenic will and an indication of a healthy, invigorating life, whereas the elevation of the Apollonian over the Dionysian marks modern-European pessimism--the impotence of theoretical reason and the death of art.<br><br>Kubrick’s last film takes hold of these Romantic notions in an attempt to restore that intermediate place between dream and reality or fantasy and rationality. In other words, the tragedy of Eyes Wide Shut begins with the failure of these two layers of human activity to come into contact or interact. Here, tragedy arises not from the conflict itself but rather from its repression or lack. It represents the tendency to flee the tragic; to shut one’s eye’s to it, or to escape into an empty fantasmatic realm devoid of life. <br><br>But there is also a misleading air to the title and to these opening scenes. Contrary to first impression, this film is not about sexual obsession or intimacy, or not only about these, but about the illusion of intimacy and the gripping hold of fantasy over what seems to be a perfectly respectable, wealthy bourgeois family. The digest-perfect existence of Doctor Hartford (Tom Cruise) and his wife Alice, a bankrupt gallery owner, collapses as the undercurrent of desire, violence, and death emerges. Inasmuch as their eyes are wide shut to each other, they can yield to this repressed other side of dream and intoxication.<br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>This manipulation of desire and death is augmented to the point of physical uneasiness through the repetition of a piano note that marks the moments when Bill’s ecstatic transgression and our fascination turns into obsession (Ananke--necessity).</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> <br><br>The subsequent episodes unfold on the streets of New York and over the rainbow following that Freudian principle according to which every fantasy is an imaginary fulfillment of some prohibited and repressed desire. Both Alice and Bill seem to lack intimacy and passion, a result of the division between their individual fantasies and their shared, everyday life. Bill’s rational detachment leaves no room for desire whereas Alice, already in wonderland, lacks the reality that turns fantasy into lust. She dreams of exposure and passionate, uninhibited encounters; <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>he complements these dreams by acting them out</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> (1). <br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>Taking the central stage are a pair of ordinary modern professionals whose very normality drives them into madness.</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> <br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>The more they wish to shape, control, and manipulate their lives, the more destructive and irrational they become.</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> <br><br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>As in many of Kubrick’s films, over-systemization and Clockwork control carries within it the seed of self-destruction. In the case of Eyes Wide Shut, the breach between dream and actuality or desire and rationality gives rise to its other side--the total fusion of fantasy and reality. Both extremes (total separation or total fusion) are destructive or impossible, hence the tragic conflict and the intrusion of death.</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> <br><br>The Hartfords are ensnared in this destructive vacillation, but we--the viewers—are in no better shape. Like the Hartfords, we are caught up in a logic of either/or, unable to balance our fantasies and our everyday world. The autonomy of art, announced by Kant more than two centuries ago, had reached its culmination with the modern viewer’s experience of films. Art--and films in particular--no longer provokes us to think about our own reality, but on the contrary, they provide an alternative one. Ironically, the more the movie succeeds as a fantasy, the less it is able to criticize the tendency to flee away from this tragic split. How then can a movie mount a criticism of itself? In what way can a medium of fantasies and illusions bridge the modern tragic chasm separating dreams and the everyday?<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br><br><!--EZCODE LINK START--><a href="http://www.longpauses.com/blog/2000/04/eyes-wide-shut-1999.html" target="top">long pauses</a><!--EZCODE LINK END--><br><br><br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>In Eyes Wide Shut (1999), Stanley Kubrick's adaptation of Arthur Schnitzler's novella, Traumnovelle (1926), Dr. Bill Harford experiences a similar dissolution, though the film essentially reverses the basic plot structure of Joyce's story, thereby turning its focus on the terrifying consequences of that epiphany rather than its preludes (and giving us, in effect, a glimpse of the proverbial "morning after" that has intrigued readers of "The Dead" for decades). Bill's wife, Alice, confesses in the opening act that, while on vacation, she had fantasized about abandoning her family in exchange for even one night with a naval officer who was staying in their hotel. "I was ready to give up everything," Alice tells her disbelieving husband. "You, Helena [their daughter], my whole fucking future. Everything" (49). The admission explodes Bill's imagined subjectivity, sending him on a dizzying odyssey through the streets of New York, where he encounters a string of Others, both women and men, with whom he attempts to recapture the unity that has suddenly become lost to him. <br><br><br>His search is necessarily in vain, however, as is evidenced by the film's conclusion. Bill's decision to "tell [Alice] everything" and Alice's desire to "fuck . . . as soon as possible" are desperate, and ultimately unsatisfying, attempts to mask Bill's permanently split subjectivity behind established ideological structures and jouissance. His inevitable lack of satisfaction, I will argue, is likewise experienced by the film viewer, who is presented with a story that steadfastly refuses to tie together its many loose ends. In fact, in his attempts to force "progression [and] effective closure" on the source material, Kubrick's co-writer, Frederick Raphael, instead further exposes the futility of such an endeavor (Raphael, 119). Sean Murphy's conclusion concerning Gabriel Conroy and "The Dead" can, I think, be likewise applied to Bill Harford and Eyes Wide Shut: "[He] will never achieve the unity that the linear narrative supposedly achieves at the end; he can never illuminate the entire beginning and middle of his consciousness via some epiphany because his subjectivity is forever split" (471).<br><br><br><br>In 1970, Joseph Gelmis asked Stanley Kubrick why he wished to make a film about Napoleon. Fresh from his recent success with 2001: A Space Odyssey (1968), the filmmaker claimed to have found in the French leader a subject that spoke to his own fascination with history and strategy, while remaining "oddly contemporary — the responsibilities and abuses of power, the dynamics of social revolution, the relation of the individual to the state, war, milatirism, etc." <br><br><br>Schnitzler's novel negotiates that border zone where selflessness, responsibility, and commitment meet narcissism, fantasy, and desire, the product of which is a mutually reaffirming masquerade: Fridolin and Albertine ultimately return to the comfortable roles of husband/father and wife/mother, denying all that would jeopardize their performances. Or, as Leonard has noted, <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>"one performs masques because the alternative is to have no sense of destiny at all; one wears masks to keep intact the illusion that behind them one has a real face that must be protected"</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> (5). Traumnovelle and Eyes Wide Shut rip away those masks, and force both the characters and the readers/viewers to confront the unsettling consequences of doing so.<br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>How can the masculine subject survive when all that defines it is revealed to be fiction?</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--><br><br><br><!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em>"Much of what they say to one another in conversation is compulsively banal precisely because what they cannot know is so alarming. . . . Conversation is dangerous, as Gabriel learns, because it is always an attempted seduction of the Other, and one's sense of self may be subverted as easily as it may be confirmed" (291).</em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> <br><br> <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>Terrified by their brief glimpses of truth, Bill and Alice retreat to the familiar roles of husband/father and wife/mother so as to disguise their unity behind ideological masks. When they do fuck, it will simply be a return of jouissance, Lacan's term for the pleasure we find in enjoying our symptoms.</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--> But that pleasure will necessarily be short-lived and unsatisfying. Like Gabriel Conroy, Bill Harford "will never achieve the unity that the linear narrative supposedly achieves at the end; he can never illuminate the entire beginning and middle of his consciousness via some epiphany because his subjectivity is forever split" (Murphy, 471).<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Um - <br><br><!--EZCODE IMAGE START--><img src="http://www.museumoftheamericanwest.org/shop/product_images/selena.gif" style="border:0;"/><!--EZCODE IMAGE END--><br><br><br><br><!--EZCODE FONT START--><span style="color:blue;font-family:comic sans ms;font-size:xx-small;">....</span><!--EZCODE FONT END--> <p></p><i></i>
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Bohemian Grove

Postby eyes closed tight » Thu Dec 08, 2005 4:22 pm

<br>Check out this ritual<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://media.portland.indymedia.org/images/2005/03/313570.jpg">media.portland.indymedia....313570.jpg</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>Dark Secrets:<br>Inside Bohemian Grove<br><br><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://www.infowars.com/bg1.html">www.infowars.com/bg1.html</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--> <p></p><i></i>
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Re: How to put on a bra

Postby Project Willow » Thu Dec 08, 2005 4:27 pm

<!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :rollin --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/roll.gif ALT=":rollin"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <br><br>I'm sorry, I had to laugh, but it's really not funny. How many other little private practices do we make assumptions about because we are isolated from each other?<br><br>I also hook mine from the back. Those damn wires can scratch when you rotate it around after hooking it. It was definitely a skill that had to be practiced.<br><br>(Dare I say, it's very cute how men fumble with the things.) <p></p><i></i>
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Re: How to put on a bra

Postby Col Quisp » Thu Dec 08, 2005 4:38 pm

I stand corrected! I never realized that other women reached around back to fasten a bra. I just can't do it, with a slightly arthritic arm. And it seems difficult to fasten by "feel." Sorry to detract from this thread. It's a really good thread. <p></p><i></i>
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Re: Bohemian Grove

Postby FourthBase » Thu Dec 08, 2005 4:48 pm

<!--EZCODE AUTOLINK START--><a href="http://media.portland.indymedia.org/images/2005/03/313570.jpg">media.portland.indymedia....313570.jpg</a><!--EZCODE AUTOLINK END--><br><br>Whoa, WTF.<br><br>Are those devils that I see depicted?<br>Where has this picture been all this time?<br><br>1915?!!! <p></p><i></i>
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that's it....

Postby sw » Thu Dec 08, 2005 5:51 pm

edit
Last edited by sw on Mon Jan 22, 2007 2:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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