Hollywood Scripting

[Spiro C. Thiery]

I suppose I should watch it again after all these years but I remember it as pretty atrocious for valorizing a murderous monster. The landscape photography didn't make up for that.

However, even if on second viewing I end up agreeing with your opinion of The Searchers (I just added it to my Netflix queue), would that change anything?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2006/aug/25/2

Blood, sweat and tears in the desert
Alex Cox
The Guardian, Friday 25 August 2006
Last week I went to a screening of John Ford's The Searchers. The unusual thing was that it was shown in Monument Valley, the famous location for so many westerns. How many chances do you get to see these pictures screened in the place where they were filmed? So I rented a car that was big enough to sleep in, and drove from Oregon to Monument Valley to take in the show.

It's a journey of about 1,300 miles, and most of it is desert, once you descend from the pine forests. You see so many buttes and mesas and coloured rock formations en route that Monument Valley's famous pinnacles seem almost homely and human-scale by comparison.

Perhaps that was what attracted John Ford to the place. Ford made many westerns, and all the good ones were shot here. Sergio Leone used it in Once Upon a Time in the West as a handsome occasional backdrop, but Ford inhabited the place: there are some studio sequences, but almost all of The Searchers was shot in the Valley. Really shot there: there is no back-projection, no fake horse-riding against a blue screen. Ford took his actors to the desert, and got them dirty, hot and sweaty. That was how he made them act.

The Searchers is an unusual film. Very few American films deal with race, and race hatred, in such unsentimental terms. Its hero, Ethan Edwards - played by John Wayne - is an embittered Confederate soldier, who, in the aftermath of the war, has become a bandit. He has little time for anyone, white or red, unless they're his immediate family. In particular, he hates Indian renegades, and when a band of Commanche renegades massacre his nearest and dearest, he embarks on a 10-year trek to rescue a white girl, Debbie, whom the Commanche chief, Scar, has kidnapped.

The postmodern take on The Searchers is that Ethan Edwards is a racist. Ford's view of him is more ambiguous. Reflecting this, the organisers of the screening made up two posters, both depicting Wayne's face: one says Soldier, Lover, Uncle, Hero; the other, Bigot, Racist, Killer ... Hero. That is indeed the character he plays.

At one point, he and his sidekick, the ridiculous Marty, find several women who have been kidnapped by Scar's band. "It's hard to believe they're white," burbles Marty. "They ain't white any more - they're Commanche," Ethan grimly replies. When he finds that Debbie (Natalie Wood in lipstick and a Pocahontas outfit) has gone native, he decides to kill her. But he can't go through with it. And, notably, it's Ethan Edwards, not the pious Marty or the preacher sheriff, who can speak Commanche and Navajo.

What does modern America make of The Searchers? Every town of the old west has sent kids - poor whites, poor Indians - to the Iraq war. Each town has a sign welcoming the kids back, or mourning the one who died. Each town has a video store, full of western DVDs, The Searchers often prominently displayed.

There aren't any simple answers in The Searchers. Wayne is bad, but Wayne does good. Scar is bad, but is he worse than Edwards - the embittered killer, veteran of an ignoble war, whose family need his capacity for violence, but don't like him any more? At the end of the film the reunited survivors enter the family home. Wayne/Edwards waits outside. He wants to be invited in. But nobody invites him. They don't need his violence now, and so they close the door.

No such complex film could be made by Hollywood today. In the absence of any truth-telling - about racial issues, about the easy American bent for violence, about the homeland which seems to need that violence, yet won't cop to it - perhaps it's time to revisit The Searchers. Even if it's not on the big screen against the buttes of Monument Valley, it's still worth a serious look.

[Spiro C. Thiery]

In other words, these men were artists, geniuses, really, making the films they wanted to make, many of which turned out to be great films, and many of which sold the promise of the American Way. I don't feel bad about that. The American Way sure ain't what it used to be.

Grandpa, tell us 'bout the good ol' days.

[IanEye]

given a choice between a Pollock or a Norman Rockwell I would gaze on the Rockwell any day. Heck, I'd rather spend an afternoon in the Thomas Kinkaide store.

Mr.Cox is quite the connoisseur.

"This grumpy old race car I know once told me somethin' , it's just an empty cup."

Best wishes to you, Hugh, whoever you were and wherever you are.

indeed. best wishes for 2013, Hugh!

[Wombaticus Rex]

I really hope we see him emerge with something published in 2013.

He could just do a history of MOCKINGBIRD and I'd buy 10 copies. The man was thorough and putting his work out into an even bigger shark tank of criticism would only make the Thesis stronger.

Because, shit, it's not like anyone could convince him to change his mind, and that...is a beautiful thing.

[barracuda]

In other words, these men were artists, geniuses, really, making the films they wanted to make, many of which turned out to be great films, and many of which sold the promise of the American Way. I don't feel bad about that. The American Way sure ain't what it used to be.

Grandpa, tell us 'bout the good ol' days.

Was there ever a moment in which the American Way was anything but a scam used to defraud the majority, a cell to imprison the minority, and a cash cow for the very few? Maybe not. But hopefully I don't have to explain that in detail, sonny boy. [/getoffmylawn]

[Spiro C. Thiery]

In other words, these men were artists, geniuses, really, making the films they wanted to make, many of which turned out to be great films, and many of which sold the promise of the American Way. I don't feel bad about that. The American Way sure ain't what it used to be.

Grandpa, tell us 'bout the good ol' days.

Was there ever a moment in which the American Way was anything but a scam used to defraud the majority, a cell to imprison the minority, and a cash cow for the very few? Maybe not. But hopefully I don't have to explain that in detail, sonny boy. [/getoffmylawn]

Sorry, I couldn't help but respond in the good old fashion tradition of "Statements like this just discredit the entire essay for me."

[barracuda]

Sorry, I don't get it, but it wouldn't be the first time. Could you hold my hand through your thought process here? Help an old lady across the street or sumpfin?

[Spiro C. Thiery]

Sorry, I don't get it, but it wouldn't be the first time. Could you hold my hand through your thought process here? Help an old lady across the street or sumpfin?

But of course. Beginning with your original, with a slight detour:

It explains how the work of a talentless boozer, Jackson Pollock, found its way into museums owned by the Rockefellers, and thence onto gallery walls all over the US. Pollock's slap-dash canvases were bought and sold - at US taxpayers' expense - to show that American art was "better" than the crude naturalism which Russians supposedly preferred. Unfortunately, most Americans prefer crude naturalism, as do I: given a choice between a Pollock or a Norman Rockwell I would gaze on the Rockwell any day. Heck, I'd rather spend an afternoon in the Thomas Kinkaide store.

Statements like this just discredit the entire essay for me. Firstly, that's not really a fair synopsis of the Pollock section of Saunder's book. But more importantly, the idea that Pollock was a talentless painter is absurd: not only is his early Benton-influenced figurative work startlingly original and beautiful (see here or here, but his eventual transformation into the action-painter changed the world. Cox would rather spend an afternoon looking at Thomas Kinkade? I don't think people should brag about their lack of taste, frankly.

The detour: I do believe the Kinkade comparison was meant to be pejorative, Cox' professed preference for naturalism aside. It is ironic that you don't think people should brag about their lack of taste--"frankly", no less--when you just did.
But that's neither here nor there. I mean, really.

Anyway, this...

In other words, these men were artists, geniuses, really, making the films they wanted to make, many of which turned out to be great films, and many of which sold the promise of the American Way. I don't feel bad about that. The American Way sure ain't what it used to be.

...amidst your much broader criticism of Cox' inaccurate portrayal of certain text, is just too rich in irony considering the thread it appears in.

There were any number of silly, snarky comments I might have made, among them the standard Do tell! or more cheesier Oh, reeeeeally? or the more cloaked in faux-ernestness Tell me about it, what with the way things are theeeese days! or a more severely pointed It would seem the propaganda--both the sterile, patriotic variety, and the poisonous alphabet soup kind--has affected you more than you might think.

But I settled for the Gramps crack, not least of which because it's from a famous country tune, but also because it fit the mode, and, as I said in my most recent reply prior to this one: It reduced all that work you put into your original commentary to a sort of Statements like this just discredit the entire essay for me.

Except I didn't go on at length after making the claim. Until now (thanks very much).

[barracuda]

The detour: I do believe the Kinkade comparison was meant to be pejorative, Cox' professed preference for naturalism aside. It is ironic that you don't think people should brag about their lack of taste--"frankly", no less--when you just did.
But that's neither here nor there. I mean, really.

Alright, we're getting closer. A question: When did I brag about my own lack of taste? Cuz I'm still not getting that part.

There were any number of silly, snarky comments I might have made, among them the standard Do tell! or more cheesier Oh, reeeeeally? or the more cloaked in faux-ernestness Tell me about it, what with the way things are theeeese days! or a more severely pointed It would seem the propaganda--both the sterile, patriotic variety, and the poisonous alphabet soup kind--has affected you more than you might think.

I think I understand this part - you're saying that because these men made films about patriotic themes and loved the state, that somehow this, in and of itself, is to you a reflection of a lack of quality in their productions? That is, because they made films that demonstrated their love, interest, and appreciation for America, that somehow disqualifies their work as having value as art?

This strikes me as simply a variation of what you might call the biographical fallacy: that the biography of the artist is a determinant in the critique of his work. In this case, if the politics of the artist's output don't agree with your own, the art cannot be effective. If that's what you mean, I disagree.

John Ford was a wartime member of the OSS. Nevertheless, he made some transcendent works of art. Those artworks transcended the political bent they carried with them. Merian Cooper was an Air Force general. Nevertheless, he was an important technical film innovator and a brilliant producer. Is King Kong somehow less a staggering achievement for you because its creator was also a soldier? Do people have to be so one-dimensional? I don't think so. Fact is, they aren't. And again, great art has been made by terrible people, for terrible reasons. If that diminishes the work for you, that is, imo, your loss.

Also, some straight speaking wouldn't hurt, if you wanna be understood. I'm not a mind-reader, ya know.

[elfismiles]

You know what's weird about this thread? This is the thread in which Hugh Manatee Wins apparently ended his entire career of posting on the internet. Hugh was a compulsive poster with an electro- paper trail all over the web leading up to the moment when his account was suspended a few pages back. Then - complete radio silence. Nothing. I would not have thought that would be possible. I've searched for his unique keyword combinations many times since, but to no avail.

Best wishes to you, Hugh, whoever you were and wherever you are.

There have been hints that he took up residence at a certain other RI-users forum...

Re: A Toast to Banned and Disappeared Posters
by lupercal » 01 Jun 2012 02:54
http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/ ... 56#p464256

thanks MinM, Jeff I know this is perplexing but I hope some simple solution can be arrived at that would allow Hugh to continue posting here as his analysis is perfectly suited to RI and adds something unique and valuable to the forum that can be gotten nowhere else, thanks!

My peace and justice action forum: http://peaceonearth.myfreeforum.org

Re: A Toast to Banned and Disappeared Posters
by lupercal » 02 Jun 2012 02:26
http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/ ... 87#p464487

Sim I said Hugh's analysis is perfectly suited to RI, and it is, because it combines intense language scrutiny with an interest in criminal weirdness. RI is where he hashed out his theory, where he's made 9,866 posts in seven years, somewhere between 2 and 3% of all posts here, also where his PMs are, where Google searches on his examples and key words land, and so on. Basically it's his online home and while it's entirely possible that he's decided to move on, I hope he hasn't, and that he can keep posting here, as he has a way of cutting through crap like no one else.

And yes, of course, he has a standing invitation to join my forum, as does everyone here for that matter, and I'd be delighted to see him there. But that's a different issue.

Re: Hollywood Scripting
by lupercal » 08 Jun 2012 13:02
http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/ ... 49#p465449

Now if you're suddenly seized with a desire to know all about KWH you're going to have to ask Hugh directly, but he's been banned from this forum, thanks in no small part to your antics, so you'll have to come to mine and see if he'll answer you there. Frankly I don't see why he'd waste his time, but you can try. I'd better warn you though that if you do you'll need to behave a lot better than you've behaved here.

[barracuda]

There have been hints that he took up residence at a certain other RI-users forum...

No, believe me, I've looked there.

[JackRiddler]

Thesis, antithesis, synthesis!

[JackRiddler]

If your primary response to allegations that the CIA covertly started, wrote, changed, censored, promoted and/or blocked Hollywood projects in psychological operations to influence people's politics is to pick one of the example movies and say, "but it's a great movie, who cares who made it?" then no, you don't (seem to care to) get it.

[barracuda]

If that's all you've got for me, then you ain't got much.

[Project Willow]

I have difficulty moving my eye away from what appears to be the letters T and P, up and to the right of the fellow's head, and which I interpret to stand for "toilet paper".